WEBVTT

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When we think of
prisons, if we bother

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to think of them
at all, that is,

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there is a tendency to see
them as institutions completely

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divorced from human society.

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The Justice
Department said today

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the inmate population of
federal and state prisons

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in this country is
at an all-time high.

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The public sees a
need for more prisons

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because crime is the
number one concern

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of the people in this state.

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Too many inmates and
not enough space.

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Another crime, another
criminal, in a country

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already fed up with both.

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People stacked up liked
cord wood in our prisons.

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There\'s a population explosion
in America\'s prisons.

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Overcrowding this country\'s
jails and prisons.

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Prison populations
are exploding.

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A record number of people are
now being held behind bars.

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Half the inmates
in federal prison

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are drug offenders today.

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[OVERLAPPING VOICES]

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A shocking new number
was released today

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and it deserves our
undivided attention.

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One out of every 100 Americans
is now behind bars, locked up

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in prison or in jail.

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The most important thing
is to talk from your heart.

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If you have more than one child,
give like an overall message

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but then do an individual
one to each child.

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Throw them a kiss,
talk to them about what

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you do daily, the rest
should be just you.

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If you\'ve written a poem,
we\'ve had people pray,

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we\'ve had people sing.

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One guy showed his little boy
how to shoot a basketball.

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Be creative.

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These are gifts to your
children and your families.

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OK, any questions?

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The families are punished
right along with the offender.

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People don\'t think so but
the collateral consequences

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of somebody\'s incarceration
affects not just

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that whole family but it
affects the whole community.

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It affects you as an individual,
whether you know it or not.

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And whether you know that person
or not that\'s incarcerated,

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you\'re paying for him.

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You should care.

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I have a background in film
and video as a producer

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and I thought, there\'s got
to be something I can do.

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So why not combine my
career and my experience

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with the prison
system and come up

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with something for these kids?

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When a parent looks
in that camera,

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they\'re looking at their child
and if they can look at them

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and say, this isn\'t your
fault. You did nothing wrong.

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It means a lot.

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And for many of
these men and women,

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it\'s the first time they\'ve
really taken responsibility,

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which is huge.

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And that\'s a first step
in recovery of any kind,

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any kind, is to

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take the
responsibility for it.

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But even when I\'m
far away, this love

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I have will stay and wrap
itself around you every minute

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of the day

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.

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I ju

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st want you guys
to know that I\'m

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going to do the best I can
to stay out of this place

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and continue striving
forward with my life.

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I\'ve missed you guys all a lot.

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I\'m glad this is
the last Christmas

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I\'m going to have to
spend away from you all.

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I just want

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you guys to
know that I miss you all,

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can\'t wait to be with you all.

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That\'s it.

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I love you all, take care.

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I love you all.

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Bye, bye.

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Nice job.

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Modern prisons are an
invention of Quakers.

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Quakers had this idea that if
you gave people an opportunity

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to silently reflect, to become
penitent, leading to the term

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penitentiary, that they would
reflect upon their misconduct

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and be reformed.

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The first practical use of
it was really in the United

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States, in Philadelphi

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a.

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Tried to provide positive change
and change someone\'s behavior

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but it was partly as
a movement to get away

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from corporal or
capital punishment,

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to come up with
something be

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tter.
The problem, and the
thing that people forgot,

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was going into a
monastery voluntarily

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and isolating yourself in
order to pray and think

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is very different than
being pushed into a cell

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by the state.

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One of the things
that seems to be

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tr

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ue

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tr

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i

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ue

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n

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i

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th

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n

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e

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th

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hi

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e

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st

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hi

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or

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st

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y

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or

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y

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of

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p

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of

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ri

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p

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so

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ri

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n

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so

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sy

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n

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st

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sy

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em

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st

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s

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em

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s

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is that the philosophies change
but the buildings remain.

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So you had these
massive buildings

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that are these major
expenditures and very often

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just used as essentially
human warehouses.

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You would occasionally
get people

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that would try different kinds
of experiments in education

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and therapeutics in some way,
in inmate self-government,

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but usually they
were fairly quickly

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overwhelmed by the
crowding in the system

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or because they were
politically unpopular.

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From 1920 until 1970,
this whole half-century

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of American history, the
rate of incarceration

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was roughly level at
about 110 per 100,000.

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And this is a broad
span in our history.

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This is the Roaring
\'20s and Prohibition,

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the Depression and
all the social change

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there, World War II, the
postwar economic boom,

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the \'50s explosion
of suburbia, the \'60s

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and all the social turbulence.

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Through this whole period,
the rate of incarceration

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is roughly level in the United
States at about 110 per 100,000

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and this reflects the
policies of police departments

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and prosecutors and
judges operating

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all over the country,
local and state level.

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And then in 1970,
this all changes

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so that by now, the
rate of incarceration

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nationwide is over
700 per 100,000.

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The rate of incarceration for
African-Americans is over 4,000

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per 100,000.

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And so you have to
wonder what changed?

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Why did this
half-century of stability

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get upended with this dramatic
increase in incarceration

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in the United States?

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America\'s public enemy n

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umber
one in the United States

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is drug abuse.

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Once the federal

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government decided

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that we were going to
have a war on drugs,

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they were able to then
take a lot of money

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from the federal budget
and then send it out

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to states and localities.

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I realize the need for money
to deal with this problem.

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I am glad that in
this administration,

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we have increased
the amount of money

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for handling the problem of
dangerous drugs seven-fold.

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It will be $600
million this year.

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More money will be
needed in the future.

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Virtually everybody thought
the drug war was the number one

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issue and so you had politicians
in both parties and district

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attorneys and elected
sheriffs, everybody

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wanted to get into drug cases
and get aggressive about it.

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First, I am
recommending legislation

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making the penalty for
all illegal trafficking

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in hard drugs a life
sentence in prison.

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The issue before the
US Supreme Court today,

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mandatory life sentences for
possession of large quantities

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of drugs

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.

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That is the law in Michigan.

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California Governor
Pete Wilson

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signed

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that state\'s new Three
Strikes and You\'re Out law.

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It requires a sentence
of life in prison

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without parole for at least
25 years for anyone convicted

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of a third violent felony.

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Most of American
policing is done

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at the state and l

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ocal level.

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So although the federal
government may have expanded,

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you may have seen bigger
budgets for the DEA and the FBI

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and their drug investigations,
the bigger impact

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was the sending
of federal dollars

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down to state and local
police departments

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where they get to
hire more officers,

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hire more prosecutors.

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And once you do that hiring,
then they start arresting more.

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And more and more people
start coming into the system

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and then you\'ve got to
expand the prison capacity.

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New laws to punish them,
new agents to arrest them,

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new prosecutors to convict them,
and new prisons to hold them.

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We moved to Trenton
when I was very young.

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When we moved here, we
moved

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to Miller Homes.

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We used to always run up
and down the hallways.

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Of course, it was the
projects, so sometime we

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would sneak up on
the roof, which

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was the top floor, the
12th floor and look out.

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And of course, that was
very scary as a young child.

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But when you\'re
living in the projects

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there\'s only so much stuff
that you can get into.

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My broth

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er was
tragically killed when

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he was ran over by a truck.

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And I remember specifically
going to the corner

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where it happened at
and seeing all the blood

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because they left all the
blood still in the street.

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That traumatic experience
of losing

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my only brother

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and that truck accident, I know
it had done something to me

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but drugs we

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re my escape.

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That time was hard

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all the way around

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because my son was doing drugs,
my nephews was doing drugs,

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my nieces was doing drugs,
my sisters were doing drugs.

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It was like an
epidemic of drug abuse.

00:10:04.999 --> 00:10:08.000
And I cannot explain it.

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I cannot explain my fe

00:10:08.625 --> 00:10:11.166
elings
because at that time I

00:10:11.166 --> 00:10:15.834
didn\'t know how I felt. I was
sad because I felt like they

00:10:15.834 --> 00:10:19.999
was ruining their lives but
there was nothing I could do

00:10:19.999 --> 00:10:23.125
about it to change
their lifestyle.

00:10:23.959 --> 00:10:26.125
So, that was it.

00:10:31.917 --> 00:10:35.792
Most historians look at the
origin of the war on drugs

00:10:35.792 --> 00:10:38.750
as something of President
Nixon with his speeches

00:10:38.750 --> 00:10:44.333
and his creation of the DEA and
other agencies in the 1970s.

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But the war on drugs
as we understand it

00:10:47.041 --> 00:10:52.999
with enormous caseloads and
a filled up prison population

00:10:52.999 --> 00:10:57.000
is really a feature of the
1980s under President Reagan.

00:10:57.125 --> 00:10:58.875
Drugs are menacing our society.

00:10:58.875 --> 00:11:00.959
They\'re threatening our
values and undercutting

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our institutions.

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They\'re killing our children.

00:11:04.750 --> 00:11:07.333
Under Reagan, there was
a tremendous increase

00:11:07.333 --> 00:11:10.500
in federal spending
for anti-drug activity,

00:11:10.500 --> 00:11:13.667
cabinet level efforts,
and Congress creating

00:11:13.667 --> 00:11:15.542
very powerful new laws.

00:11:15.542 --> 00:11:18.333
All of what we understand
of the war on drugs today

00:11:18.333 --> 00:11:20.750
is really a creation
of the 1980s.

00:11:20.750 --> 00:11:23.583
On day two of his new
campaign against drugs,

00:11:23.583 --> 00:11:26.500
the President backed up
his tough talk with action.

00:11:26.500 --> 00:11:29.041
We\'re getting tough on
drugs and we mean business.

00:11:29.041 --> 00:11:30.625
It\'s almost like
overnight we had

00:11:30.625 --> 00:11:35.500
this great idea, hey, why
don\'t we go after the users?

00:11:35.500 --> 00:11:36.709
And that\'s what we did.

00:11:36.709 --> 00:11:39.208
We started going after the
users and the prison population

00:11:39.208 --> 00:11:42.999
soared because obviously, there
are far more users than there

00:11:42.999 --> 00:11:45.917
are operations,
major operations.

00:11:45.917 --> 00:11:49.500
And we started
treating sick people,

00:11:49.500 --> 00:11:52.999
people who were addicted to
these drugs like criminals.

00:11:53.583 --> 00:11:55.792
After my brother
passed away, I kind of

00:11:55.792 --> 00:11:58.000
withdrew from a lot of things.

00:11:58.000 --> 00:11:58.291
I didn\'t

00:11:58.333 --> 00:11:58.999
talk as much.

00:11:58.999 --> 00:11:59.125
I wa

00:11:59.166 --> 00:11:59.875
s very quiet.

00:11:59.875 --> 00:12:05.999
Probably as early as my teenage
years, 12, 13 years old,

00:12:05.999 --> 00:12:09.208
I started sneaking and drinking
a little bit here and there.

00:12:09.208 --> 00:12:12.417
I started smoking marijuana
at a very young age.

00:12:12.417 --> 00:12:19.999
I started selling drugs and
he came right along with it.

00:12:21.625 --> 00:12:24.250
Family, you tend
to trust family.

00:12:24.250 --> 00:12:26.709
Once I started
selling loose joints,

00:12:26.709 --> 00:12:28.542
I graduated to
selling nickle bags

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and then I graduated to
selling half ounces and ounces.

00:12:31.208 --> 00:12:36.999
So it was slowly progression
of me wanting more money,

00:12:36.999 --> 00:12:41.000
me wanting to do more,
that I progressed

00:12:41.000 --> 00:12:43.792
from the legal side
of shining shoes

00:12:43.792 --> 00:12:45.999
and cleaning windows to
the illegal side of selling

00:12:45.999 --> 00:12:47.333
loose joints and nickle bags.

00:12:47.333 --> 00:12:50.625
Well, when I first saw
him it was in the hallway.

00:12:50.625 --> 00:12:53.000
And I used to be a
hall patrol monitor

00:12:53.000 --> 00:12:57.125
and I was stationed right
in front of his locker.

00:12:57.125 --> 00:13:00.375
So when I knew that he
was coming to his locker,

00:13:00.375 --> 00:13:04.792
I would put my hands up
and like block his way.

00:13:04.792 --> 00:13:08.792
So he would have to say
excuse me or something.

00:13:08.792 --> 00:13:11.291
And after that, we
started talking.

00:13:11.291 --> 00:13:14.999
We got to know each other after
walking her home many times

00:13:14.999 --> 00:13:18.999
and hanging out
over at her house.

00:13:19.083 --> 00:13:22.917
My home wasn\'t really a
home compared to her house.

00:13:22.917 --> 00:13:26.709
Margaret grew up with her
parents, both her parents home,

00:13:26.709 --> 00:13:26.999
in a nice, d

00:13:26.999 --> 00:13:28.041
ecent house.

00:13:28.041 --> 00:13:31.750
Great mother, great father,
something that I didn\'t have.

00:13:31.750 --> 00:13:34.834
And I started just
being around her a lot

00:13:34.834 --> 00:13:36.125
and being around
her family a lot.

00:13:36.125 --> 00:13:39.959
And the next thing you knew,
I was pretty much... once we

00:13:39.959 --> 00:13:41.500
started going together
I was pretty much

00:13:41.500 --> 00:13:44.999
living at her house at the
age of 14, 15 years old.

00:13:44.999 --> 00:13:48.792
I was pretty much staying there
because my mom was on drugs.

00:13:48.792 --> 00:13:50.542
As long as she knew
where I was at,

00:13:50.542 --> 00:13:52.166
she really didn\'t have
a problem with it.

00:13:52.166 --> 00:13:54.625
But I kind of started
living and staying

00:13:54.625 --> 00:13:57.583
with Margaret at
a very young age.

00:13:57.583 --> 00:14:00.792
By the time I was
16, 17, I was fully

00:14:00.792 --> 00:14:02.208
engulfed in the drug game.

00:14:02.208 --> 00:14:02.458
And Tr

00:14:02.458 --> 00:14:03.709
enton is only but so big.

00:14:03.709 --> 00:14:05.834
Trenton is only
7.5 square miles.

00:14:05.834 --> 00:14:08.375
So a lot of rumors had
started spreading along

00:14:08.375 --> 00:14:09.458
So a lot of rumors had
started spreading along

00:14:09.458 --> 00:14:09.999
to the Trenton detectives.

00:14:09.999 --> 00:14:10.583
Back then, they
had two dete

00:14:10.625 --> 00:14:11.917
ctives

00:14:11.917 --> 00:14:14.166
that worked the high
school and they kind of

00:14:14.166 --> 00:14:15.834
got to know me very well.

00:14:15.834 --> 00:14:18.542
And I guess they relayed that
information to the Trenton

00:14:18.542 --> 00:14:21.208
narcotics and they started
watching me and following me

00:14:21.208 --> 00:14:22.834
around and stuff like that.

00:14:22.834 --> 00:14:27.999
And I remember the first time
that they raided my house,

00:14:27.999 --> 00:14:30.291
I wasn\'t there but
my mother was there.

00:14:30.291 --> 00:14:33.667
And I think I had
just turned 17.

00:14:33.667 --> 00:14:36.041
And they locked her up
and I got a phone call

00:14:36.041 --> 00:14:37.999
saying that your
mother was locked up

00:14:37.999 --> 00:14:40.959
and they wanted you
to turn yourself in.

00:14:40.959 --> 00:14:42.999
So eventually I turned
myself in at 17.

00:14:42.999 --> 00:14:43.999
They let my mother go.

00:14:43.999 --> 00:14:48.792
The first time me ever going to
jail, I went to the youth house

00:14:49.083 --> 00:14:50.458
because I wasn\'t 18.

00:14:50.500 --> 00:14:51.959
I was only still a juvenile.

00:14:51.959 --> 00:14:56.542
We were still in high school
and we missed the prom

00:14:56.792 --> 00:14:57.750
and he missed graduation.

00:14:57.750 --> 00:14:58.083
When I got out, I

00:14:58.125 --> 00:14:58.166
re

00:14:58.166 --> 00:14:58.208
me

00:14:58.208 --> 00:14:58.250
mb

00:14:58.250 --> 00:14:58.250
Wh

00:14:58.250 --> 00:14:58.291
er

00:14:58.291 --> 00:14:58.291
en

00:14:58.291 --> 00:14:58.333
t

00:14:58.333 --> 00:14:58.333
I

00:14:58.333 --> 00:14:58.375
he

00:14:58.375 --> 00:14:58.375
g

00:14:58.375 --> 00:14:58.417
d

00:14:58.417 --> 00:14:58.417
ot

00:14:58.417 --> 00:14:58.458
et

00:14:58.458 --> 00:14:58.458
o

00:14:58.458 --> 00:14:58.500
ec

00:14:58.500 --> 00:14:58.500
ut

00:14:58.500 --> 00:14:58.542
ti

00:14:58.542 --> 00:14:58.542
,

00:14:58.542 --> 00:14:58.583
ve

00:14:58.583 --> 00:14:58.583
I

00:14:58.667 --> 00:15:00.500
remember the detective

00:15:00.500 --> 00:15:03.208
telling me that as
soon as I turn 18,

00:15:03.208 --> 00:15:05.375
that they was going to
come back and get me.

00:15:05.375 --> 00:15:07.999
And if I didn\'t
straighten up my life,

00:15:07.999 --> 00:15:09.999
that first experience
would be nothing compared

00:15:09.999 --> 00:15:13.750
to my other experiences in jail
because then I will be over 18

00:15:13.750 --> 00:15:17.458
and I will be going
into an adult facility.

00:15:17.750 --> 00:15:20.250
The recent deaths of athletes
Len Bias and Don Rogers

00:15:20.250 --> 00:15:22.667
have made drug abuse
a political issue.

00:15:22.667 --> 00:15:25.959
Len Bias, gone to high
school here in Washington,

00:15:25.959 --> 00:15:27.542
went to the University
of Maryland,

00:15:27.542 --> 00:15:29.875
which is right here
inside the Beltway.

00:15:29.875 --> 00:15:33.999
And the Maryland team was
the champion team in 1986.

00:15:33.999 --> 00:15:38.625
They won the NIT championship
and Bias was their star.

00:15:38.625 --> 00:15:41.125
The world champion Celtics
use their first round draft

00:15:41.125 --> 00:15:44.875
choice to pick Bias to play
for them after his graduation.

00:15:44.875 --> 00:15:48.999
This morning, Len Bias was dead
of cardiorespiratory arrest.

00:15:48.999 --> 00:15:50.792
No one knows why yet.

00:15:50.792 --> 00:15:52.875
There are reports
that traces of cocaine

00:15:52.875 --> 00:15:55.999
were founded in Bias\'s system.

00:15:55.999 --> 00:15:58.999
The Speaker of the House is
from Boston, Tip O\'Neill,

00:15:58.999 --> 00:16:02.542
and people are stunned
all over the country.

00:16:02.999 --> 00:16:03.792
How did this happen?

00:16:03.792 --> 00:16:04.333
Here we are inside
the DC Beltw

00:16:04.375 --> 00:16:05.834
ay,

00:16:05.834 --> 00:16:09.917
Congress just went crazy
and emotionally started

00:16:09.917 --> 00:16:14.792
ramping things up and creating
tough on crime policies related

00:16:14.792 --> 00:16:14.999
to d

00:16:14.999 --> 00:16:16.709
rugs.
Last week, House Democrats
said they would come up

00:16:16.709 --> 00:16:19.709
with a legislative packet and
they criticized the President

00:16:19.709 --> 00:16:21.999
for failing to fund
anti-drug efforts.

00:16:21.999 --> 00:16:25.999
Unfortunately, there
has been a failure

00:16:25.999 --> 00:16:29.917
to recognize the vital
urgency of this problem.

00:16:29.917 --> 00:16:33.125
But at the White House, they say
they got to this issue first.

00:16:33.125 --> 00:16:35.709
No, there\'s no
politics going on here.

00:16:35.709 --> 00:16:37.917
I mean, five years
ago, I\'ve been doing

00:16:37.917 --> 00:16:39.500
this for five years, Chris.

00:16:39.500 --> 00:16:43.458
The President has talked up a
good argument in declaring war

00:16:43.458 --> 00:16:46.959
but he certainly hasn\'t put
together much of an arsenal.

00:16:46.959 --> 00:16:49.792
Politicians in both parties
say people are so concerned

00:16:49.792 --> 00:16:52.000
about drugs right now
that no one in Washington

00:16:52.000 --> 00:16:54.542
can afford to be seen
as ignoring the problem.

00:16:54.542 --> 00:16:58.333
In July 1986, when the
Democratic leadership

00:16:58.333 --> 00:17:00.750
figured out that
this was a big issue

00:17:00.750 --> 00:17:04.834
and they wanted to make it the
central issue of the election,

00:17:04.834 --> 00:17:07.750
they only had four weeks
until the August recess,

00:17:07.750 --> 00:17:10.500
which is when people are
going to go off and campaign.

00:17:10.500 --> 00:17:13.500
So that\'s a very
short period of time

00:17:13.500 --> 00:17:15.250
and they were asking
committees that

00:17:15.250 --> 00:17:18.959
had nothing to do with drugs,
small business, merchant marine

00:17:18.959 --> 00:17:22.000
and fisheries, post
office and civil service.

00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:24.375
Everybody is
supposed to kick in.

00:17:24.375 --> 00:17:24.999
Every House chairman
who\'

00:17:24.999 --> 00:17:26.333
s a Democrat

00:17:26.333 --> 00:17:31.500
is going to contribute to this
big stew of legislation that\'s

00:17:31.500 --> 00:17:34.250
going to be brought to the
floor right after Labor Day.

00:17:34.250 --> 00:17:36.500
So this is an
incredibly short period

00:17:36.500 --> 00:17:39.834
of time to write very
complicated laws.

00:17:39.834 --> 00:17:42.999
No hearings, no research,
no prison impact analysis,

00:17:42.999 --> 00:17:45.083
racial impact analysis, nothing.

00:17:45.083 --> 00:17:48.750
It was done, as way
too much legislation

00:17:48.750 --> 00:17:51.458
is done in this country,
very thoughtlessly.

00:17:51.458 --> 00:17:51.959
And if you\'re mo

00:17:51.959 --> 00:17:53.250
ving
very, very fast

00:17:53.250 --> 00:17:58.125
and you don\'t have time to get
the considered impact from people

00:17:58.125 --> 00:18:01.333
that are going to have to live
with and carry out this law,

00:18:01.333 --> 00:18:01.583
you\'

00:18:01.583 --> 00:18:03.999
re going to make mistakes.

00:18:04.458 --> 00:18:06.583
We made mistakes.

00:18:08.709 --> 00:18:11.375
My birthday was
September the 12th.

00:18:11.709 --> 00:18:12.959
In 1980, I turned 18.

00:18:12.959 --> 00:18:15.000
They came back and locked
me up and caught we

00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:17.750
with drugs September the 16th.

00:18:17.750 --> 00:18:17.999
So they

00:18:17.999 --> 00:18:20.999
kept their promise
that they made to me

00:18:21.250 --> 00:18:21.999
and fulfilled that promise.

00:18:21.999 --> 00:18:26.999
So once again, at the age
of 18, I was back in jail

00:18:26.999 --> 00:18:29.917
facing numerous drug
charges at this time.

00:18:29.917 --> 00:18:31.542
Because of my
juvenile record, it

00:18:31.542 --> 00:18:34.999
was evident that I was going
to do some time this time.

00:18:35.458 --> 00:18:38.999
And when he came
home, he got a job.

00:18:38.999 --> 00:18:42.083
He was on the right
track and then

00:18:42.083 --> 00:18:47.834
he just started back doing
drugs, selling drugs.

00:18:48.083 --> 00:18:50.750
And at that time, we separated.

00:18:50.875 --> 00:18:51.625
Even though I
remember my first bin

00:18:51.625 --> 00:18:54.041
and I know the pain
that I put my girlfriend

00:18:54.041 --> 00:18:55.999
in and my family
through and everything,

00:18:55.999 --> 00:19:00.333
my father and stuff
like that, by 1988 it

00:19:00.333 --> 00:19:04.750
had become a complete
distant memory for me.

00:19:05.583 --> 00:19:09.959
And sometime drugs have a
way of masking your memory.

00:19:09.999 --> 00:19:11.375
I knew jail was bad.

00:19:11.375 --> 00:19:11.667
I knew

00:19:11.667 --> 00:19:13.041
I never wanted
to go back again

00:19:13.041 --> 00:19:17.375
but when you\'re hooked on drugs,
you just don\'t think about it.

00:19:17.375 --> 00:19:17.542
Yo

00:19:17.583 --> 00:19:19.500
u just don\'t
want the money, you

00:19:19.500 --> 00:19:22.583
want everything else
that come along with it.

00:19:22.583 --> 00:19:25.041
Because when you\'re at
that level in the streets,

00:19:25.041 --> 00:19:28.542
you could lose your
life and sometimes drugs

00:19:28.542 --> 00:19:30.999
help you forget that that
part is still out there.

00:19:30.999 --> 00:19:33.999
I could just focus on the
money so I can get high

00:19:33.999 --> 00:19:35.999
and I can float away.

00:19:35.999 --> 00:19:37.542
I remember talking
to my grandmother

00:19:37.542 --> 00:19:40.500
and having that conversation
with her about my life

00:19:40.500 --> 00:19:42.709
and how far I had fallen.

00:19:42.709 --> 00:19:46.000
She said to me, Tracey, I\'m
going to always pray for you

00:19:46.000 --> 00:19:49.999
and I\'m going to pray that
you change your life around.

00:19:49.999 --> 00:19:52.291
And one of things that she
said that stuck with me

00:19:52.291 --> 00:19:56.583
was that God is going to
find you in your darkest hour

00:19:56.583 --> 00:19:59.583
and only then will you
realize who you truly are.

00:19:59.583 --> 00:20:02.583
And I heard her but I
really didn\'t hear her.

00:20:02.583 --> 00:20:04.583
And I left her house
that Thanksgiving

00:20:04.583 --> 00:20:07.792
dinner and went right
back out into the streets.

00:20:07.792 --> 00:20:10.500
I remember going to
New York, the cop

00:20:10.500 --> 00:20:12.999
and coming back from New
York, coming down Route 1,

00:20:12.999 --> 00:20:14.999
coming through Union County.

00:20:14.999 --> 00:20:19.333
We had drugs in the car and
we had a gun in the car.

00:20:19.333 --> 00:20:21.542
And I remember being
stopped at a light

00:20:21.542 --> 00:20:23.792
and getting out and
switching drivers.

00:20:23.792 --> 00:20:25.999
I got around to
the passenger side

00:20:25.999 --> 00:20:29.667
and she took the driver\'s
seat, not knowing

00:20:29.667 --> 00:20:31.625
that it was a cop
car right behind us.

00:20:31.625 --> 00:20:33.959
So once again, I didn\'t
want to go to court.

00:20:33.959 --> 00:20:35.709
I wasn\'t going to trial.

00:20:35.709 --> 00:20:37.999
I told my lawyer
that we just have

00:20:37.999 --> 00:20:40.999
to try to get all the
charges pushed together,

00:20:40.999 --> 00:20:43.083
get me one sentence,
let me go do my time,

00:20:43.083 --> 00:20:44.709
and hopefully,
straighten up my life.

00:20:44.709 --> 00:20:47.999
Well, I remember specifically,
the judge, the citizen

00:20:47.999 --> 00:20:52.458
judge telling me that now I\'m a two-time loser.

00:20:52.458 --> 00:20:55.583
And he said, Tracey, you
were convicted in 1980

00:20:55.583 --> 00:20:55.999
and now you\'re

00:20:55.999 --> 00:20:57.999
convicted again in 1988.

00:20:57.999 --> 00:20:58.250
He said come back

00:20:58.250 --> 00:20:59.959
before
me for the third time

00:20:59.959 --> 00:21:02.875
and the third time is going
to be a charm for you.

00:21:02.999 --> 00:21:06.333
The direction to a
judge to sentence

00:21:06.333 --> 00:21:06.458
ca

00:21:06.500 --> 00:21:06.999
n be done in two ways.

00:21:06.999 --> 00:21:11.291
You can say Judge, here\'s
a crime and for this crime

00:21:11.291 --> 00:21:14.208
you can impose a
sentence anywhere

00:21:14.208 --> 00:21:18.583
in this range from
probation to some term

00:21:18.583 --> 00:21:20.333
of years imprisonment.

00:21:20.333 --> 00:21:22.834
The other way is
to say, Judge, you

00:21:22.834 --> 00:21:27.291
must impose some minimum
number of years or months

00:21:27.291 --> 00:21:29.999
of imprisonment and
go up from there.

00:21:29.999 --> 00:21:32.625
So a mandatory minimum,
this is sentence,

00:21:32.625 --> 00:21:36.125
where no matter how minor
the role of the offender,

00:21:36.125 --> 00:21:41.208
no matter how insignificant a
violation of this crime it is,

00:21:41.208 --> 00:21:41.625
a minimum term m

00:21:41.667 --> 00:21:44.999
ust be imposed.

00:21:45.208 --> 00:21:48.875
So I have all this and then
we get into personal data

00:21:48.875 --> 00:21:48.999
You\'ll

00:21:48.999 --> 00:21:48.999
s

00:21:48.999 --> 00:21:49.000
ee

00:21:49.000 --> 00:21:49.041
a

00:21:49.041 --> 00:21:49.083
s

00:21:49.083 --> 00:21:49.083
of

00:21:49.083 --> 00:21:49.125
yo

00:21:49.125 --> 00:21:49.125
t

00:21:49.125 --> 00:21:49.166
u

00:21:49.166 --> 00:21:49.166
he

00:21:49.166 --> 00:21:49.208
re

00:21:49.208 --> 00:21:49.208
f

00:21:49.208 --> 00:21:49.250
ad

00:21:49.250 --> 00:21:49.250
am

00:21:49.250 --> 00:21:49.250
t

00:21:49.291 --> 00:21:49.291
il

00:21:49.291 --> 00:21:49.291
hi

00:21:49.333 --> 00:21:49.333
y.

00:21:49.333 --> 00:21:49.333
s,

00:21:49.417 --> 00:21:49.458
Yo

00:21:49.458 --> 00:21:49.458
th

00:21:49.458 --> 00:21:49.500
u\'

00:21:49.500 --> 00:21:49.500
is

00:21:49.500 --> 00:21:49.542
ll

00:21:49.542 --> 00:21:49.542
g

00:21:49.542 --> 00:21:49.583
s

00:21:49.583 --> 00:21:49.583
et

00:21:49.583 --> 00:21:49.625
ee

00:21:49.625 --> 00:21:49.625
s

00:21:49.625 --> 00:21:49.667
a

00:21:49.667 --> 00:21:49.667
re

00:21:49.667 --> 00:21:49.709
s

00:21:49.709 --> 00:21:49.709
al

00:21:49.709 --> 00:21:49.750
yo

00:21:49.750 --> 00:21:49.750
ly

00:21:49.750 --> 00:21:49.792
u

00:21:49.792 --> 00:21:49.792
r

00:21:49.792 --> 00:21:49.834
re

00:21:49.834 --> 00:21:49.834
ig

00:21:49.834 --> 00:21:49.875
ad

00:21:49.875 --> 00:21:49.875
ht

00:21:49.875 --> 00:21:49.917
t

00:21:49.917 --> 00:21:49.917
d

00:21:49.917 --> 00:21:49.959
hi

00:21:49.959 --> 00:21:49.959
ow

00:21:49.959 --> 00:21:49.999
s,

00:21:49.999 --> 00:21:49.999
n

00:21:49.999 --> 00:21:52.583
this gets really right down

00:21:52.583 --> 00:21:52.834
to the

00:21:52.875 --> 00:21:52.999
nitty-gritt

00:21:52.999 --> 00:21:52.999
y.

00:21:52.999 --> 00:21:55.709
Removed from the home at
six years old and placed

00:21:55.709 --> 00:21:55.834
in

00:21:55.875 --> 00:21:56.667
foster care.

00:21:56.667 --> 00:21:59.999
Attempted suicide several
times during childhood

00:22:00.166 --> 00:22:01.125
starting at age seven.

00:22:01.125 --> 00:22:03.999
And where this
individual was placed

00:22:03.999 --> 00:22:06.291
in the course of the
juvenile activity,

00:22:06.291 --> 00:22:08.999
what their physical
condition is,

00:22:08.999 --> 00:22:11.208
what their mental and
emotional health is.

00:22:11.208 --> 00:22:13.999
In this case, we
have some diagnoses

00:22:13.999 --> 00:22:14.625
of all kinds of problems

00:22:14.625 --> 00:22:14.667
.

00:22:14.709 --> 00:22:15.291
This takes quite a while
for a presen

00:22:15.333 --> 00:22:16.583
tence officer

00:22:16.583 --> 00:22:19.542
to put this together
but I certainly

00:22:19.542 --> 00:22:21.750
have a pretty good idea
what I\'m dealing with.

00:22:21.750 --> 00:22:25.709
Substance abuse, lots of
that in this particular case,

00:22:25.709 --> 00:22:26.250
methamphetamines.

00:22:26.250 --> 00:22:28.458
Education, that\'s
a little bit short.

00:22:28.458 --> 00:22:32.917
Employment, here, there,
and everywhere but not much.

00:22:32.917 --> 00:22:35.709
Financial condition,
that\'s usually real skimpy.

00:22:35.709 --> 00:22:38.999
And then this is the
five-year minimum,

00:22:38.999 --> 00:22:45.041
maximum 40 years, guideline
range, 168 to 210.

00:22:45.041 --> 00:22:47.500
That\'s the initial
guideline range.

00:22:47.500 --> 00:22:50.500
And what the
sentencing options are.

00:22:50.500 --> 00:22:52.625
Bureau prisons, what
they charge to keep them,

00:22:52.625 --> 00:22:54.625
which never means
anything to us.

00:22:54.625 --> 00:22:57.166
And then Mr. Heinka
signed his name

00:22:57.166 --> 00:23:00.333
on this 30-page
presentence report.

00:23:00.333 --> 00:23:03.458
So I have this whole
thing to look at.

00:23:03.458 --> 00:23:05.250
I finish this,
there\'s not much more

00:23:05.250 --> 00:23:06.999
I need to know about
this individual.

00:23:06.999 --> 00:23:09.208
More than I ever wanted to know.

00:23:09.208 --> 00:23:10.999
Mandatory minimum
sentences are not new.

00:23:10.999 --> 00:23:14.834
They\'ve been on the books in
this country for 200 years

00:23:14.834 --> 00:23:18.999
and there are about 190
of them or something.

00:23:18.999 --> 00:23:21.583
And if you look at them, they
read like the crime Du jour.

00:23:21.583 --> 00:23:24.250
So you can see what the
public was concerned about

00:23:24.250 --> 00:23:25.999
and then Congress
took that concern

00:23:25.999 --> 00:23:29.999
and translated it into law,
into sentencing legislation.

00:23:29.999 --> 00:23:34.625
So piracy on the high
seas in, like, 1790s

00:23:34.625 --> 00:23:34.999
got you life

00:23:34.999 --> 00:23:36.041
without parole.

00:23:36.041 --> 00:23:36.542
Robbing banks an

00:23:36.542 --> 00:23:39.375
d crossing
state lines in 1934

00:23:39.375 --> 00:23:41.333
was 10 years in prison.

00:23:41.333 --> 00:23:45.291
Skyjacking in the \'70s was
10 or 20 years in prison.

00:23:45.291 --> 00:23:45.917
And so you can see what

00:23:45.917 --> 00:23:48.750
the headlines were,

00:23:48.750 --> 00:23:52.250
the headlines were translated
into a mandatory sentence.

00:23:52.250 --> 00:23:56.041
So in the \'80s when drugs became
a big deal and lots of concern

00:23:56.041 --> 00:23:59.999
about drugs, it was in the
top three of public concern,

00:23:59.999 --> 00:24:04.709
Congress reacted by creating
new mandatory minimum sentences

00:24:04.709 --> 00:24:05.041
for drug crimes.

00:24:05.041 --> 00:24:08.166
I started work for the
House Judiciary Committee

00:24:08.166 --> 00:24:08.583
in November

00:24:08.583 --> 00:24:09.999
1979.

00:24:09.999 --> 00:24:10.375
I had just turne

00:24:10.375 --> 00:24:11.041
d 30.

00:24:11.041 --> 00:24:14.750
Very young lawyer, not quite
four years of experience

00:24:14.750 --> 00:24:17.417
practicing law,
to work rewriting

00:24:17.417 --> 00:24:20.667
the entire federal
criminal code for Father

00:24:20.667 --> 00:24:23.542
Drinan, the chairman of the
criminal justice subcommittee.

00:24:23.542 --> 00:24:25.417
A few months later,
Drinan announces

00:24:25.417 --> 00:24:28.917
he\'s not running for reelection
and is out of Congress

00:24:28.917 --> 00:24:30.999
within 14 months.

00:24:30.999 --> 00:24:34.625
And so I was traded in
the beginning of 1981

00:24:34.625 --> 00:24:38.917
to the house crime subcommittee
to Congressman Hughes,

00:24:38.917 --> 00:24:42.458
the new incoming chairman,
where my responsibilities were

00:24:42.458 --> 00:24:47.000
writing federal law dealing
with drugs, gun control, money

00:24:47.000 --> 00:24:50.999
laundering, organized
crime, pornography,

00:24:50.999 --> 00:24:52.917
and a host of other issues.

00:24:52.917 --> 00:24:55.792
In the 1950s, the practice
of giving mandatory sentences

00:24:55.792 --> 00:24:57.999
as a deterrent became
fairly widespread.

00:24:57.999 --> 00:25:00.999
By the 1970s, the consensus
was they weren\'t fair

00:25:00.999 --> 00:25:03.999
and didn\'t work and there was
no reduction in drug crime

00:25:03.999 --> 00:25:07.333
so a great many of the
mandatory terms were dropped.

00:25:07.750 --> 00:25:08.291
Well, now they\'re back.

00:25:08.291 --> 00:25:12.999
When I was asked, Eric, give
us a mandatory minimum proposal

00:25:12.999 --> 00:25:17.250
in this week in August as
this is being put together,

00:25:17.250 --> 00:25:21.917
I said, OK, let\'s see what the
Justice Department is defining

00:25:21.917 --> 00:25:25.417
as the highest level
traffickers and we\'ll give them

00:25:25.417 --> 00:25:27.834
these mandatory sentences.

00:25:27.834 --> 00:25:30.999
These were hundreds of
thousands of doses of drugs

00:25:30.999 --> 00:25:33.999
a month for at least six months.

00:25:33.999 --> 00:25:38.667
So when I bring this back to
the subcommittee in our markup,

00:25:38.667 --> 00:25:40.709
Congressman Ron Mazzoli
from Louisville, Kentucky

00:25:40.709 --> 00:25:42.999
looks at this and says,
well, wait a minute.

00:25:42.999 --> 00:25:45.999
We don\'t have drug dealers
that big in Louisville.

00:25:45.999 --> 00:25:48.083
We\'re not going to use
this statute in Louisville.

00:25:48.083 --> 00:25:50.709
Now, no one turned
to Ron and said,

00:25:50.709 --> 00:25:54.458
Ron, nobody goes to
Louisville to do a dope deal.

00:25:54.458 --> 00:25:54.667
It a

00:25:54.667 --> 00:25:56.041
in\'t Miami.

00:25:56.208 --> 00:25:56.875
It\'s not Houston.

00:25:56.875 --> 00:25:58.166
You should be glad
you\'re not going

00:25:58.166 --> 00:26:00.250
to need this in Louisville.

00:26:00.250 --> 00:26:02.667
But instead, it
was, oh yeah, yeah.

00:26:02.667 --> 00:26:04.333
Ron\'s right, yeah.

00:26:04.375 --> 00:26:08.417
These high-level traffickers,
they\'re too high level.

00:26:08.417 --> 00:26:08.750
Eric, br

00:26:08.750 --> 00:26:09.875
ing up something else.

00:26:09.875 --> 00:26:13.208
It\'s all based on one
factor, your sentence,

00:26:13.208 --> 00:26:15.999
what was the drug and how
much of it did you have?

00:26:15.999 --> 00:26:17.583
And that determines
your sentence.

00:26:17.583 --> 00:26:19.250
So culpability no
longer really plays

00:26:19.250 --> 00:26:21.959
a major role in a
person\'s sentence

00:26:21.959 --> 00:26:24.333
when the crime carries
a mandatory minimum.

00:26:24.333 --> 00:26:24.999
What Congress sent
to P

00:26:24.999 --> 00:26:26.625
resident Reagan

00:26:26.625 --> 00:26:32.959
was five year mandatory minimum,
five grams of crack cocaine.

00:26:32.959 --> 00:26:33.542
A gram is like a
Sweet\'N Low pa

00:26:33.542 --> 00:26:35.709
cket.

00:26:35.709 --> 00:26:35.999
10 years min

00:26:35.999 --> 00:26:41.709
imum is 50
grams of crack cocaine.

00:26:41.709 --> 00:26:43.917
That\'s like the
weight of a candy bar.

00:26:43.917 --> 00:26:45.166
These are tiny quantities.

00:26:45.166 --> 00:26:50.999
It goes back to the analogy of
a traffic ticket with $100 cost.

00:26:50.999 --> 00:26:53.875
Up or down, good
attitude, bad attitude,

00:26:53.875 --> 00:26:54.999
doesn\'t make any difference.

00:26:54.999 --> 00:26:55.250
It\'s $100.

00:26:55.250 --> 00:26:57.999
And it\'s that same
kind of theory

00:26:57.999 --> 00:27:02.542
that\'s applied over into
these mandatory minimums

00:27:02.542 --> 00:27:03.959
in these serious crimes.

00:27:03.959 --> 00:27:05.999
We don\'t care what
your attitude is.

00:27:05.999 --> 00:27:07.999
We don\'t care how much
education you had.

00:27:07.999 --> 00:27:10.542
We don\'t care what the
ameliorating circumstances

00:27:10.792 --> 00:27:11.041
where.

00:27:11.041 --> 00:27:11.417
You did it

00:27:11.417 --> 00:27:12.000
.

00:27:12.000 --> 00:27:13.542
So therefore...

00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:17.999
And a lot of us, human nature
doesn\'t work quite that way.

00:27:17.999 --> 00:27:20.500
And that\'s why we say,
wait a minute. wait

00:27:20.500 --> 00:27:20.999
a minute, wait a min

00:27:20.999 --> 00:27:20.999
ut

00:27:20.999 --> 00:27:20.999
e.

00:27:20.999 --> 00:27:21.458
This is not what we\'re her

00:27:21.500 --> 00:27:24.000
e for.

00:27:24.000 --> 00:27:28.709
We\'re here as judges,
trained, dedicated,

00:27:28.709 --> 00:27:33.250
to look at the whole picture
and come to a just result.

00:27:33.250 --> 00:27:33.917
The thing that mandatory

00:27:33.917 --> 00:27:35.041
minimum sentences do

00:27:35.041 --> 00:27:38.458
is they completely remove
the judge from the sentencing

00:27:38.625 --> 00:27:38.667
An

00:27:38.667 --> 00:27:38.709
d

00:27:38.709 --> 00:27:38.709
eq

00:27:38.709 --> 00:27:38.750
so

00:27:38.750 --> 00:27:38.750
ua

00:27:38.792 --> 00:27:38.792
ti

00:27:38.792 --> 00:27:38.834
a

00:27:38.834 --> 00:27:38.834
on

00:27:38.834 --> 00:27:38.875
p

00:27:38.875 --> 00:27:38.875
.

00:27:38.875 --> 00:27:38.917
er

00:27:38.917 --> 00:27:41.959
son who
has never laid eyes

00:27:41.959 --> 00:27:45.208
on you, some legislator
in Washington

00:27:45.208 --> 00:27:48.999
sitting on Capitol Hill is
determining your sentence

00:27:48.999 --> 00:27:54.999
by saying well, if the person
has 50 grams of methamphetamine

00:27:54.999 --> 00:27:57.083
it\'s a five year sentence.

00:27:57.083 --> 00:27:58.999
So it\'s like, really?

00:27:58.999 --> 00:27:59.709
I mean, who do you
want to dete

00:27:59.750 --> 00:28:00.792
rmine

00:28:00.792 --> 00:28:01.375
your sentence, someone
you\'ve

00:28:01.375 --> 00:28:01.750
never seen,

00:28:01.750 --> 00:28:04.250
or who has never seen you or the
judge who is in the courtroom

00:28:04.250 --> 00:28:08.458
and has the most information
they can about your case?

00:28:08.458 --> 00:28:08.583
I

00:28:08.625 --> 00:28:09.250
think the fear
in the flexibility

00:28:09.250 --> 00:28:11.458
is your liberal judges are
going to give a lower sentence

00:28:11.458 --> 00:28:13.999
and your hard-nosed judges are
going to give a high sentence

00:28:13.999 --> 00:28:16.125
and therefore, we\'re
going to have variances.

00:28:16.125 --> 00:28:21.875
And I say, variances come
with people, certain variances

00:28:21.875 --> 00:28:22.125
come with people

00:28:22.125 --> 00:28:22.166
.

00:28:22.208 --> 00:28:23.959
Certain communities
are different

00:28:23.959 --> 00:28:25.542
than other communities.

00:28:25.542 --> 00:28:27.750
There are some more
liberal communities

00:28:27.750 --> 00:28:29.999
and they have more
liberal judges.

00:28:29.999 --> 00:28:33.208
Let them get what
their community wants.

00:28:36.667 --> 00:28:38.375
We\'re all frail
human beings trying

00:28:38.375 --> 00:28:41.208
to do the best we can
and one can sometimes

00:28:41.208 --> 00:28:44.083
look at a sentence of mine
and say, why in the world

00:28:44.083 --> 00:28:44.375
did he do

00:28:44.417 --> 00:28:45.125
that?

00:28:45.458 --> 00:28:45.709
They

00:28:45.709 --> 00:28:45.750
w

00:28:45.750 --> 00:28:45.792
er

00:28:45.792 --> 00:28:45.834
en

00:28:45.834 --> 00:28:45.875
\'t

00:28:45.875 --> 00:28:45.875
Th

00:28:45.875 --> 00:28:45.917
h

00:28:45.917 --> 00:28:45.917
ey

00:28:45.917 --> 00:28:45.959
er

00:28:45.959 --> 00:28:45.959
d

00:28:45.959 --> 00:28:45.999
e.

00:28:45.999 --> 00:28:45.999
id

00:28:45.999 --> 00:28:47.166
n\'t see what
I had to look at.

00:28:47.166 --> 00:28:51.291
Maybe my eyes will look at
it differently than others.

00:28:51.291 --> 00:28:53.999
But I have a colleague that
has a reputation for being

00:28:53.999 --> 00:28:58.208
a little more liberal than I but
when I compare that colleague\'s

00:28:58.208 --> 00:29:02.166
sentences to mine, roughly, no.

00:29:02.166 --> 00:29:05.125
That person\'s not any
more... if I\'m conservative

00:29:05.125 --> 00:29:06.583
and they\'re liberal,
that doesn\'t

00:29:06.583 --> 00:29:09.750
work when you compare
the actual sentences

00:29:09.750 --> 00:29:12.500
because the actual sentences,
in this particular case,

00:29:12.500 --> 00:29:15.083
that person\'s is sometimes
heavier than mine.

00:29:15.083 --> 00:29:17.333
But it all depends on
the facts of the case

00:29:17.333 --> 00:29:20.041
that we approach it with.

00:29:20.250 --> 00:29:20.999
And that\'s the way it should be.

00:29:20.999 --> 00:29:22.999
That\'s the way it should
be because sentencing

00:29:22.999 --> 00:29:24.417
should be individualized.

00:29:24.417 --> 00:29:24.999
When President Reagan signed

00:29:24.999 --> 00:29:28.375
the mandatory minimums in 1986,

00:29:28.375 --> 00:29:33.792
the federal prison
population was 36,000.

00:29:34.999 --> 00:29:37.291
Now, it\'s well over 200,000.

00:29:37.291 --> 00:29:37.583
This is

00:29:37.583 --> 00:29:40.041
a growth that no
one could have imagined.

00:29:40.041 --> 00:29:43.959
Mass incarceration in the US is
really unique in human history.

00:29:43.959 --> 00:29:45.834
There\'s no democratic
nation that\'s

00:29:45.834 --> 00:29:49.667
ever tried to have such a
massive social experiment

00:29:49.667 --> 00:29:51.834
as we\'ve done in incarceration.

00:29:51.834 --> 00:29:54.750
We have more prisoners than
any other country in the world

00:29:54.750 --> 00:29:55.000
ever by rate and num

00:29:55.041 --> 00:29:56.917
bers.

00:29:56.917 --> 00:29:57.834
I mean, I find it
a bit disturbing

00:29:57.834 --> 00:30:00.250
that we have more
prisoners than China

00:30:00.250 --> 00:30:00.417
and

00:30:00.458 --> 00:30:02.375
they have a billion
more people than we do.

00:30:02.375 --> 00:30:03.000
I don\'t think it gives
people e

00:30:03.000 --> 00:30:03.709
nough pause

00:30:03.709 --> 00:30:06.625
when they hear that we have
25% of the world\'s prison

00:30:06.625 --> 00:30:09.875
population and only 5% of
the world\'s population.

00:30:09.875 --> 00:30:10.500
In other words, we are
way over-i

00:30:10.542 --> 00:30:12.083
ncarcerating

00:30:12.083 --> 00:30:15.583
compared to any other
country in the world.

00:30:18.999 --> 00:30:20.333
Here\'s the thing that I
think the public really

00:30:20.333 --> 00:30:23.125
doesn\'t understand about
jailing in the United States is

00:30:23.125 --> 00:30:26.999
that it\'s not just
detention anymore.

00:30:27.625 --> 00:30:28.417
That\'s what it used to be.

00:30:28.417 --> 00:30:28.875
It used to be

00:30:28.875 --> 00:30:29.542
just
about detention.

00:30:29.542 --> 00:30:30.083
But now, in addition
to deten

00:30:30.125 --> 00:30:31.999
tion,

00:30:31.999 --> 00:30:35.999
we are now the largest
mental health facility

00:30:35.999 --> 00:30:36.542
in your community.

00:30:36.542 --> 00:30:38.917
Wherever you live, if
you go to the jail,

00:30:38.917 --> 00:30:41.250
they are a mental
health facility

00:30:41.250 --> 00:30:43.750
because there\'s no place
in the community that

00:30:43.750 --> 00:30:47.250
will take care of the
certain kinds of population

00:30:47.250 --> 00:30:50.583
who have a mental illness
and violate the law.

00:30:50.583 --> 00:30:52.959
In addition to that, we\'re
a hospital in the community.

00:30:52.959 --> 00:30:54.709
We have to meet all
the HIPAA regulations

00:30:54.709 --> 00:30:58.291
for being a hospital in order
to provide inmate medical care.

00:30:58.291 --> 00:31:00.834
In addition to that, according
to the federal government,

00:31:00.834 --> 00:31:04.583
we have to be a
school for people

00:31:04.583 --> 00:31:07.999
who are under the age of 21
who are learning disabled.

00:31:07.999 --> 00:31:10.999
We have to provide an equivalent
high school education.

00:31:10.999 --> 00:31:12.999
A GED will not suffice.

00:31:12.999 --> 00:31:16.375
So a team has to come
in, do an assessment,

00:31:16.375 --> 00:31:18.999
and provide
equivalent education.

00:31:18.999 --> 00:31:19.083
So we\'re n

00:31:19.125 --> 00:31:20.375
ot just
about detention.

00:31:20.375 --> 00:31:23.709
We\'re a hospital, we\'re
a mental health facility,

00:31:23.709 --> 00:31:23.999
and we\'re a

00:31:23.999 --> 00:31:23.999
sc

00:31:23.999 --> 00:31:23.999
ho

00:31:24.000 --> 00:31:24.000
ol

00:31:24.000 --> 00:31:24.041
An

00:31:24.041 --> 00:31:24.041
.

00:31:24.041 --> 00:31:24.083
d

00:31:24.083 --> 00:31:26.999
we have to do all of
those things in one package

00:31:26.999 --> 00:31:30.500
with all of the unique different
types of characteristics

00:31:30.500 --> 00:31:31.999
and individuals
that are in here.

00:31:31.999 --> 00:31:34.458
It\'s a very, very
comprehensive mission today

00:31:34.542 --> 00:31:34.917
to be in correct

00:31:34.959 --> 00:31:34.959
io

00:31:34.999 --> 00:31:34.999
ns

00:31:34.999 --> 00:31:34.999
.

00:31:34.999 --> 00:31:36.999
I think originally
the purpose of prison

00:31:36.999 --> 00:31:39.999
is to put people
that are dangerous

00:31:39.999 --> 00:31:44.792
and a threat to the society
in a place that keeps them

00:31:44.792 --> 00:31:46.999
away from us for some
period of time, either

00:31:46.999 --> 00:31:52.125
until they\'ve redeemed
themselves or been deemed

00:31:52.125 --> 00:31:54.250
unfixable.

00:31:54.250 --> 00:31:57.542
But we are so far beyond
that original model.

00:31:57.542 --> 00:32:02.083
We really do seem to think that
we can solve our social ills

00:32:02.083 --> 00:32:04.125
by simply incarcerating people.

00:32:09.333 --> 00:32:15.500
I had allowed somebody to
use a storage unit of mine.

00:32:15.500 --> 00:32:19.999
And the police found it
and they came after me.

00:32:19.999 --> 00:32:23.291
I ended up literally
holding the bag.

00:32:23.291 --> 00:32:26.999
I knew nothing about the
criminal justice system.

00:32:26.999 --> 00:32:32.291
Here I was this
middle-class mom, career,

00:32:32.291 --> 00:32:34.625
never even a parking ticket.

00:32:34.625 --> 00:32:36.999
And it was quite a surprise
when we went to court

00:32:36.999 --> 00:32:41.999
and I got that kind
of time for marijuana.

00:32:41.999 --> 00:32:45.792
I was charged with
possession of marijuana

00:32:45.792 --> 00:32:48.999
with the intent to distribute
and I got a conspiracy charge.

00:32:48.999 --> 00:32:52.000
I received a total of a
55-year prison sentence.

00:32:52.000 --> 00:32:56.083
The judge suspended all but six.

00:32:56.083 --> 00:33:00.999
I was fortunate enough
to make first parole

00:33:00.999 --> 00:33:06.999
and I actually served,
in prison, 14 months

00:33:07.709 --> 00:33:09.125
and came home.

00:33:09.125 --> 00:33:09.709
These are the cards that

00:33:09.750 --> 00:33:11.750
we\'ve put in with the messages

00:33:11.750 --> 00:33:14.041
and asked the
families to respond.

00:33:14.041 --> 00:33:16.583
So we\'ve gotten some
really good responses.

00:33:16.583 --> 00:33:22.000
And this one was three members
of the family viewed it.

00:33:23.000 --> 00:33:24.999
And we asked what were the
ages of children who saw

00:33:24.999 --> 00:33:27.333
it and she put just one age.

00:33:27.333 --> 00:33:27.667
She put

00:33:27.667 --> 00:33:28.083
six.

00:33:28.083 --> 00:33:28.834
She says extremely meaningfu

00:33:28.834 --> 00:33:31.999
l
for the daughter of the mother

00:33:31.999 --> 00:33:32.250
who was incarcer

00:33:32.291 --> 00:33:33.000
ated.

00:33:33.000 --> 00:33:33.291
She love

00:33:33.333 --> 00:33:34.208
d it.

00:33:34.875 --> 00:33:36.291
We all did.

00:33:38.458 --> 00:33:41.999
And this one said, what did the
message mean to your family?

00:33:41.999 --> 00:33:44.959
To know their family was OK.

00:33:44.999 --> 00:33:45.500
That\'s a huge part.

00:33:45.500 --> 00:33:48.875
These children want to know
that their family is OK,

00:33:48.917 --> 00:33:50.999
that their mom or dad\'s OK.

00:33:51.166 --> 00:33:52.917
There\'s so much I
want to say to you

00:33:52.917 --> 00:33:54.999
because I know it\'s been
three years since any of you

00:33:54.999 --> 00:33:56.333
have seen me.

00:33:56.625 --> 00:33:59.750
I miss you all so much and I
greatly appreciate everything

00:33:59.750 --> 00:34:01.999
you have done for me.

00:34:01.999 --> 00:34:02.750
Nothing\'s your fault. Jessica,
Erica,

00:34:02.792 --> 00:34:05.999
nothing\'s y\'all\'s fault.

00:34:05.999 --> 00:34:06.417
And anyone else

00:34:06.458 --> 00:34:07.625
in the
family that I\'ve done,

00:34:07.625 --> 00:34:12.999
that y\'all may feel that you\'re
in the fault, it\'s been me.

00:34:13.667 --> 00:34:14.999
I\'ve grown up a
lot in this time.

00:34:14.999 --> 00:34:19.125
In these last three for years
years I\'ve grown up a lot.

00:34:21.083 --> 00:34:25.083
I just want to say
that I love you.

00:34:25.959 --> 00:34:26.583
Bye.

00:34:26.917 --> 00:34:27.959
Merry Christmas.

00:34:36.750 --> 00:34:40.834
They sentenced me to one year
administrative segregation.

00:34:40.834 --> 00:34:44.125
Administrative segregation
is 23-hour lock up.

00:34:44.125 --> 00:34:46.583
You\'re locked up for
23 hours each day.

00:34:46.583 --> 00:34:51.083
You come out for a half hour
shower and a half hour break.

00:34:51.083 --> 00:34:51.500
I\'ve never bee

00:34:51.500 --> 00:34:53.667
n
a violent person.

00:34:53.667 --> 00:34:53.999
At that time

00:34:53.999 --> 00:34:55.999
, I was treated
like one of the worst

00:34:55.999 --> 00:34:57.999
violent persons in the world.

00:34:58.000 --> 00:34:59.709
I remember going into that cell.

00:34:59.709 --> 00:35:03.375
I believe it was maybe
a five by eight cell.

00:35:03.542 --> 00:35:05.750
And once that door
closed, I knew

00:35:05.750 --> 00:35:07.999
I was going to be there
for the next year.

00:35:07.999 --> 00:35:10.500
It\'s just an experience
that it either is

00:35:10.500 --> 00:35:12.500
going to make you or break you.

00:35:12.500 --> 00:35:12.917
You\'re either

00:35:12.959 --> 00:35:13.959
going to
come out a better person

00:35:13.959 --> 00:35:17.792
or you\'re going to come out
a worser person than you

00:35:17.792 --> 00:35:19.208
were before you went in.

00:35:19.417 --> 00:35:21.250
Being in a whole,
it\'s an experience

00:35:21.250 --> 00:35:21.500
that I w

00:35:21.542 --> 00:35:23.500
ouldn\'t wish on anybody.

00:35:23.500 --> 00:35:25.959
When you\'re locked
up for 23 hours,

00:35:25.959 --> 00:35:27.333
the only thing you
can do is think.

00:35:27.333 --> 00:35:31.083
My words of my grandmother
just kept playing over and over

00:35:31.083 --> 00:35:31.250
ag

00:35:31.291 --> 00:35:31.999
ain in my mind.

00:35:31.999 --> 00:35:33.834
And those words was
that God was going

00:35:33.834 --> 00:35:35.999
to find me in my
darkest hour and only

00:35:35.999 --> 00:35:38.709
then would I realize
who I truly was.

00:35:38.709 --> 00:35:41.208
And when I kept hearing
that, I kept saying,

00:35:41.208 --> 00:35:42.500
I am at my darkest hour.

00:35:42.500 --> 00:35:45.583
I am at my lowest point.

00:35:46.333 --> 00:35:48.542
And I think right
then I realized

00:35:48.542 --> 00:35:51.000
that I had reached my
lowest point in life

00:35:51.000 --> 00:35:57.166
and that the only other way
for me to go from here was up.

00:35:57.875 --> 00:36:01.250
Another crime, another
criminal in a country

00:36:01.250 --> 00:36:02.834
already fed up with both.

00:36:02.834 --> 00:36:03.417
Read him his rights.

00:36:03.417 --> 00:36:06.750
Politicians say the solution
is simple, crack down.

00:36:06.750 --> 00:36:08.999
The reason the criminal
justice system isn\'t working

00:36:08.999 --> 00:36:10.999
is that we\'re not sending
enough people to jail

00:36:10.999 --> 00:36:12.375
and keeping them
there long enough.

00:36:12.375 --> 00:36:15.375
The people are saying,
in a very general way,

00:36:15.375 --> 00:36:19.875
that they want to lock these
rascals up and keep them there

00:36:19.875 --> 00:36:19.999
for a long

00:36:19.999 --> 00:36:20.291
time.

00:36:20.291 --> 00:36:21.333
During the 1980s, there was
a major shift in the Con

00:36:21.375 --> 00:36:24.583
gress

00:36:24.583 --> 00:36:28.999
and in state legislatures about
how long sentences should be.

00:36:28.999 --> 00:36:32.875
The public was alarmed by
increasing rates of crime

00:36:32.875 --> 00:36:35.875
from the 1970s and
early \'80s and they

00:36:35.875 --> 00:36:36.166
wanted longer sentence

00:36:36.208 --> 00:36:37.834
s.

00:36:37.834 --> 00:36:38.250
They wanted cracking
do

00:36:38.250 --> 00:36:40.458
wn and that\'s

00:36:40.458 --> 00:36:43.750
what happened across the
board for all kinds of crimes,

00:36:43.750 --> 00:36:46.166
not only the mandatory
minimum drug sentences.

00:36:46.166 --> 00:36:50.750
Congress, in 1984, established
a US Sentencing Commission

00:36:50.750 --> 00:36:50.999
made up of s

00:36:50.999 --> 00:36:52.667
even members.

00:36:52.667 --> 00:36:55.083
Four had to be federal
judges, no more than four

00:36:55.083 --> 00:36:58.333
from one party, a very
bipartisan effort.

00:36:58.333 --> 00:37:01.458
And those members were
given the instructions

00:37:01.458 --> 00:37:02.999
to create a
sentencing guidelines

00:37:02.999 --> 00:37:07.208
system for all crimes, not
just drugs, any federal crime.

00:37:07.208 --> 00:37:09.500
And it would give the
judges a starting point

00:37:09.500 --> 00:37:11.250
and then they would go
up or down on a grid

00:37:11.250 --> 00:37:14.166
depending on the
culpability of the defendant

00:37:14.166 --> 00:37:14.667
and a few other fact

00:37:14.709 --> 00:37:15.542
ors.

00:37:15.542 --> 00:37:18.208
At the same time,
Congress decides

00:37:18.208 --> 00:37:22.000
to jump in with the
mandatory minimums of 1986.

00:37:22.000 --> 00:37:24.417
So before the sentencing
guidelines have really

00:37:24.417 --> 00:37:29.083
being shaped, we now have
long mandatory sentences

00:37:29.083 --> 00:37:31.917
for low level drug offenses.

00:37:31.917 --> 00:37:33.250
So the sentencing
commission now has

00:37:33.250 --> 00:37:38.083
to build guidelines on top
of the mandatory minimums.

00:37:38.083 --> 00:37:45.875
So that a consequence was that
drug trafficking that might not

00:37:45.875 --> 00:37:47.999
have been so serious,
let\'s say trafficking

00:37:47.999 --> 00:37:52.333
in 10 kilos of crack
cocaine now got

00:37:52.333 --> 00:37:56.792
you a life sentence under
the sentencing guidelines.

00:37:56.792 --> 00:37:57.999
The effect of all
those sentencing laws

00:37:57.999 --> 00:38:01.583
was not just to increase the
sentences that people were

00:38:01.583 --> 00:38:04.625
exposed to, so that people were
serving longer time in prison

00:38:04.625 --> 00:38:06.999
than they did
before, it was also

00:38:06.999 --> 00:38:10.750
to take the
discretion away from,

00:38:10.750 --> 00:38:13.999
the sentencing discretion,
away from judges and juries

00:38:13.999 --> 00:38:16.500
and shift it over
to prosecutors.

00:38:16.500 --> 00:38:16.959
It didn\'t eliminat

00:38:16.999 --> 00:38:17.542
e discretion.

00:38:17.542 --> 00:38:21.125
It just gave
prosecutors the power

00:38:21.125 --> 00:38:23.417
to determine what
your sentence was

00:38:23.417 --> 00:38:26.083
going to be by making
charging decisions

00:38:26.083 --> 00:38:29.999
and even by bargaining over what
the facts of your case were.

00:38:29.999 --> 00:38:32.333
So it didn\'t mean
that discretion

00:38:32.333 --> 00:38:32.750
was eliminated f

00:38:32.792 --> 00:38:33.792
rom the system.

00:38:33.792 --> 00:38:34.458
It just put the
prosecutors in cha

00:38:34.458 --> 00:38:35.542
rge.

00:38:35.542 --> 00:38:39.792
Prosecutors can negotiate
with you behind closed doors.

00:38:39.792 --> 00:38:42.125
It\'s not open to the public.

00:38:42.250 --> 00:38:42.458
It\'s not

00:38:42.458 --> 00:38:42.500
r

00:38:42.500 --> 00:38:42.542
ev

00:38:42.542 --> 00:38:42.583
ie

00:38:42.583 --> 00:38:42.625
wa

00:38:42.625 --> 00:38:42.625
Th

00:38:42.625 --> 00:38:42.667
bl

00:38:42.667 --> 00:38:42.667
er

00:38:42.667 --> 00:38:42.709
e.

00:38:42.709 --> 00:38:42.709
e\'

00:38:42.750 --> 00:38:44.999
s no appeal
available in the way

00:38:44.999 --> 00:38:46.166
that you\'re negotiated with.

00:38:46.166 --> 00:38:48.999
And they can basically say
to you, if you plead guilty

00:38:48.999 --> 00:38:51.792
or if you cooperate and
you give us other names,

00:38:51.792 --> 00:38:54.250
we\'ll cut you a deal and
we\'ll only charge you

00:38:54.250 --> 00:38:56.917
with one of these charges
instead of these three,

00:38:56.917 --> 00:38:59.583
and you\'ll get five
years instead of 15.

00:38:59.583 --> 00:39:02.667
So all of that goes on
behind closed doors.

00:39:02.667 --> 00:39:05.125
And they say to you, if you
don\'t cooperate with this,

00:39:05.125 --> 00:39:09.000
if you don\'t agree, we\'re going
to file a motion because you

00:39:09.000 --> 00:39:11.250
have a prior from 10
years back, we\'re going

00:39:11.250 --> 00:39:12.999
to file a motion called an 851.

00:39:12.999 --> 00:39:15.792
And if you go to trial
and lose, your five years

00:39:15.792 --> 00:39:18.959
is going to be doubled to
10 or your 10-year sentence

00:39:18.959 --> 00:39:20.125
is going to be doubled to 20.

00:39:20.125 --> 00:39:22.959
Or we can even, if
you\'ve got two priors,

00:39:22.959 --> 00:39:24.208
it\'ll put you in
prison for life.

00:39:24.208 --> 00:39:26.917
But all the decision
about how they

00:39:26.917 --> 00:39:29.333
charge these, what
charges they bring,

00:39:29.333 --> 00:39:32.792
knowing what the sentences
will be, that\'s all done behind

00:39:32.959 --> 00:39:32.999
cl

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:32.999
os

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:32.999
ed

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:32.999
d

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:32.999
It

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:32.999
oo

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:32.999
\'s

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:32.999
rs

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:32.999
a

00:39:32.999 --> 00:39:33.000
.

00:39:33.000 --> 00:39:33.000
bs

00:39:33.041 --> 00:39:34.417
olutely not
open to the public.

00:39:34.417 --> 00:39:37.999
It\'s not open to
review by a court even.

00:39:37.999 --> 00:39:37.999
An

00:39:38.000 --> 00:39:39.999
d so the power
of the prosecutor

00:39:39.999 --> 00:39:42.999
is huge in determining
sentences today.

00:39:43.750 --> 00:39:45.750
And I don\'t think
prosecutors are per Se

00:39:45.750 --> 00:39:49.667
bad people but I think
power is seductive

00:39:49.667 --> 00:39:52.125
and they have a lot of
power and they like it

00:39:52.125 --> 00:39:55.792
and they get to, not just
rack up a victory, a win,

00:39:55.792 --> 00:40:00.709
but they can also say, and he\'s
going to prison for 25 years.

00:40:02.500 --> 00:40:05.000
Amy was born in 1960.

00:40:05.000 --> 00:40:07.375
She was very, very
shy but by the time

00:40:07.375 --> 00:40:09.999
she got in high
school people confided

00:40:09.999 --> 00:40:14.291
in her, she played basketball,
she made good grades.

00:40:14.291 --> 00:40:14.500
The

00:40:14.500 --> 00:40:17.250
high school that we went to
was seventh through 12th grade.

00:40:17.250 --> 00:40:20.583
I was kind of the
little, tag along sister.

00:40:20.583 --> 00:40:22.875
Amy and my brother
were friends and Amy

00:40:22.875 --> 00:40:25.917
and my sister were friends,
but I just kind of watched her.

00:40:25.917 --> 00:40:30.417
She was always really
friendly, always really nice.

00:40:30.417 --> 00:40:30.999
This is a small town and
ev

00:40:30.999 --> 00:40:35.083
erybody knows everybody.

00:40:35.083 --> 00:40:38.000
If she got in trouble, we\'d
know about it pretty soon.

00:40:38.000 --> 00:40:42.542
I had, what I consider,
an idyllic childhood.

00:40:42.542 --> 00:40:42.999
At some point

00:40:42.999 --> 00:40:43.999
when
I\'m in college,

00:40:43.999 --> 00:40:47.250
I meet a guy that works
for Southwest Times

00:40:47.250 --> 00:40:51.417
Record, the newspaper there
in Fort Smith, Arkansas.

00:40:51.583 --> 00:40:54.750
And he asked me if I would
be a subject for him,

00:40:54.750 --> 00:40:57.208
to go out and take
some modeling photos.

00:40:57.208 --> 00:40:59.375
We went to, like,
several locations

00:40:59.375 --> 00:41:01.792
and he instilled
in me that I really

00:41:01.792 --> 00:41:04.875
ought to pursue a modeling
career, considerate it.

00:41:04.875 --> 00:41:09.166
My mother says, did you know
Amy Ralston moved to Dallas.

00:41:09.166 --> 00:41:11.417
Oh, my gosh, no, Mom.

00:41:11.417 --> 00:41:12.375
What\'s she thinking?

00:41:12.375 --> 00:41:13.875
What\'s she going to do?

00:41:13.875 --> 00:41:16.542
She said, well, I think
she\'s going to model.

00:41:16.542 --> 00:41:16.709
So

00:41:16.750 --> 00:41:18.625
I created a little
portfolio before I

00:41:18.625 --> 00:41:22.999
went to Dallas that I could
show to the modeling agencies.

00:41:22.999 --> 00:41:25.917
I was on a double date, wasn\'t
really interested in the guy

00:41:25.917 --> 00:41:26.999
that I\'d been set up with.

00:41:26.999 --> 00:41:34.542
And Sandy approached me and
asked me if I\'d like to go out

00:41:34.542 --> 00:41:36.500
and I rejected his offer.

00:41:36.500 --> 00:41:39.999
And he looked so deflated,
so I said, well, you know,

00:41:39.999 --> 00:41:42.999
if you can remember my phone
number, you can call me.

00:41:42.999 --> 00:41:43.458
Sure enough, he called

00:41:43.500 --> 00:41:44.999
a week or so later.

00:41:44.999 --> 00:41:46.999
We went on a date.

00:41:46.999 --> 00:41:49.959
He was well read, well
traveled, well educated,

00:41:49.959 --> 00:41:53.750
graduated Stanford Law School,
had gone to Princeton Theology

00:41:53.750 --> 00:41:53.999
School.

00:41:53.999 --> 00:41:57.417
So it was very appealing
to be around somebody

00:41:57.417 --> 00:41:59.583
who I was, frankly,
very impressed with

00:41:59.583 --> 00:42:01.667
and so fascinated with.

00:42:01.667 --> 00:42:01.999
And eight mont

00:42:01.999 --> 00:42:04.999
hs later,
we were getting married

00:42:04.999 --> 00:42:06.999
at the Dallas Arboretum.

00:42:06.999 --> 00:42:09.500
And all of our family
and friends were there

00:42:09.500 --> 00:42:13.709
and it was, at that point,
seemed like a dream come true.

00:42:14.375 --> 00:42:16.500
There were red flags
before we got married.

00:42:16.500 --> 00:42:20.291
There were, frankly, there were
red flags all along the way.

00:42:20.291 --> 00:42:23.667
Sandy has what I consider
to be a dual personality

00:42:23.667 --> 00:42:24.999
Sandy has what I consider
to be a dual personality

00:42:24.999 --> 00:42:30.208
and this other character would
emerge whenever he drank.

00:42:30.208 --> 00:42:34.667
I literally had to
do something radical.

00:42:34.667 --> 00:42:37.792
The only remedy to
remove him from my life

00:42:37.792 --> 00:42:39.208
was for me to leave Dallas.

00:42:39.208 --> 00:42:41.999
I had to leave Dallas and I had
to leave all my friends behind

00:42:41.999 --> 00:42:46.250
and completely move
to a different city.

00:42:46.250 --> 00:42:51.875
Amy finally left Sandy
but he wouldn\'t leave her.

00:42:51.875 --> 00:42:52.333
I just kept saying, you
kn

00:42:52.333 --> 00:42:54.125
ow, let\'s be friends.

00:42:54.125 --> 00:42:55.542
Let\'s be friends.

00:42:55.542 --> 00:42:57.083
He wanted it to be more.

00:42:57.083 --> 00:43:01.875
So he told me that he
was going to Europe.

00:43:01.875 --> 00:43:05.041
And then I never heard
anything for a while.

00:43:05.041 --> 00:43:09.375
The word got back to me
that he had been arrested.

00:43:09.625 --> 00:43:11.333
I hadn\'t been in
Dallas in over a year.

00:43:11.333 --> 00:43:14.166
So the only thing I knew
to do was to book a flight

00:43:14.166 --> 00:43:17.999
and go to Dallas and see if
I could go through the house,

00:43:17.999 --> 00:43:19.709
listen to the answering
machine, and try

00:43:19.709 --> 00:43:21.834
to piece this thing
together, and eventually, you

00:43:21.834 --> 00:43:23.792
think you\'re going to
find out more information.

00:43:23.792 --> 00:43:26.458
And while I was in the
Dallas house, the phone rang.

00:43:26.458 --> 00:43:29.959
And it was Sandy\'s
German legal counsel

00:43:29.959 --> 00:43:32.792
who had been assigned
to the case in Germany.

00:43:32.792 --> 00:43:38.417
And at that time, he
gave me very thin details

00:43:38.417 --> 00:43:42.999
but said Sandy had been arrested
for manufacturing ecstasy

00:43:42.999 --> 00:43:46.500
and that he wanted me to
retain an attorney for him

00:43:46.500 --> 00:43:48.625
there in Dallas.

00:43:48.625 --> 00:43:49.208
It was a pretty interesting

00:43:49.208 --> 00:43:52.959
revelation, but I did.

00:43:52.959 --> 00:43:56.375
There was money in the safe
that was in the house in Dallas.

00:43:56.375 --> 00:43:58.999
And I took that money and
I retained an attorney

00:43:58.999 --> 00:44:02.834
to go over and meet
with Sandy in Germany.

00:44:03.250 --> 00:44:05.709
Seven months after
Sandy\'s been arrested

00:44:05.709 --> 00:44:07.166
and I pull into the garage.

00:44:07.166 --> 00:44:11.000
My car is rushed by law
enforcement people, who

00:44:11.000 --> 00:44:13.333
are screaming and have
a gun out and they\'re

00:44:13.333 --> 00:44:14.875
pointing it at my face.

00:44:14.875 --> 00:44:17.625
I\'m being told, you know,
you\'re in hot water.

00:44:17.625 --> 00:44:19.709
We know that your
husband was arrested.

00:44:19.709 --> 00:44:20.542
We know you know.

00:44:20.542 --> 00:44:22.750
We know you visited
him in Germany.

00:44:22.750 --> 00:44:25.500
And they said, we know
you have information

00:44:25.500 --> 00:44:29.417
and all you have to do is
just tell us what you know.

00:44:29.417 --> 00:44:31.875
And I wasn\'t going
to say anything

00:44:31.875 --> 00:44:36.125
because I\'m literally watching
these people destroy my home.

00:44:36.125 --> 00:44:38.999
This isn\'t somebody that I
really want to confide in.

00:44:38.999 --> 00:44:41.709
So it wasn\'t very
long after that

00:44:41.709 --> 00:44:45.166
that my lawyer explained
to me exactly what it

00:44:45.166 --> 00:44:47.959
is that my prosecutor wanted.

00:44:47.959 --> 00:44:48.417
They wanted her to
wear

00:44:48.417 --> 00:44:52.208
a wire and try

00:44:52.208 --> 00:44:56.458
to implicate other people,
people she didn\'t even know.

00:44:56.458 --> 00:45:00.667
And she refused to do it.

00:45:00.667 --> 00:45:02.166
She said, I don\'t
know these people

00:45:02.166 --> 00:45:04.125
and I\'m not going to do this.

00:45:04.125 --> 00:45:07.000
And this prosecutor said,
you either cooperate,

00:45:07.000 --> 00:45:09.959
and I\'m paraphrasing
now, you either cooperate

00:45:09.959 --> 00:45:11.709
or we\'ll ruin your life.

00:45:11.709 --> 00:45:16.500
I was in Los Angeles and
it was March of 1991.

00:45:16.500 --> 00:45:22.375
And I go over and I look out
the window and there they are.

00:45:22.375 --> 00:45:24.999
So I was arrested that day.

00:45:24.999 --> 00:45:30.999
Her father and I wanted her to
plea bargain but I understand,

00:45:30.999 --> 00:45:34.291
Amy is not going to
implicate somebody and make

00:45:34.291 --> 00:45:36.583
a criminal out of them
when she doesn\'t even

00:45:36.583 --> 00:45:38.999
know just to save her own skin.

00:45:38.999 --> 00:45:41.208
Now, that\'s not my daughter.

00:45:41.208 --> 00:45:47.500
So she wouldn\'t do this and
as a result, they ruined her.

00:45:48.333 --> 00:45:50.999
I could not plead
guilty to everything

00:45:50.999 --> 00:45:52.458
that they accused me of.

00:45:52.458 --> 00:45:56.917
So I plead not guilty
and ultimately,

00:45:56.917 --> 00:45:59.999
I was convicted for
conspiracy and I

00:45:59.999 --> 00:46:03.750
received a 24-year sentence.

00:46:03.750 --> 00:46:03.999
There\'s a wa

00:46:03.999 --> 00:46:06.999
y in which you
have to see the conspiracy

00:46:06.999 --> 00:46:10.999
law as a very important
tool of law enforcement.

00:46:10.999 --> 00:46:16.999
If the crime is selling
drugs and some man in Miami

00:46:16.999 --> 00:46:23.959
sells 20 kilos of cocaine
to an undercover agent,

00:46:23.959 --> 00:46:28.500
you want to ask, who is
the seller working for?

00:46:28.709 --> 00:46:30.291
Where does the money go?

00:46:30.458 --> 00:46:33.375
If the money goes
back to a drug lord

00:46:33.375 --> 00:46:37.999
in Colombia, who\'s going
to keep the proceeds.

00:46:37.999 --> 00:46:41.041
He\'s in the conspiracy even
though he actually wasn\'t

00:46:41.041 --> 00:46:44.041
there when the sale took place.

00:46:44.041 --> 00:46:44.250
He\'s

00:46:44.291 --> 00:46:45.458
a conspirator.

00:46:45.458 --> 00:46:48.667
And so part of the goal
of the conspiracy law

00:46:48.667 --> 00:46:53.375
is to make sure that the
most senior level of those

00:46:53.375 --> 00:46:56.999
in the criminal organization
are justly punished.

00:46:56.999 --> 00:46:59.250
The problem is when
you flip it around

00:46:59.250 --> 00:47:02.417
and the lowest level people
in the criminal organization

00:47:02.417 --> 00:47:05.250
get punished just like
they\'re the kingpin.

00:47:05.250 --> 00:47:05.999
And that\'s the big problem in

00:47:05.999 --> 00:47:08.583
the way in which the conspiracy

00:47:08.583 --> 00:47:11.500
laws are being applied.

00:47:12.250 --> 00:47:15.667
I end up in federal prison
in Dublin, California.

00:47:15.667 --> 00:47:18.875
I realized that I would
need to spend a lot of time

00:47:18.875 --> 00:47:23.917
in the law library and I
needed to familiarize myself

00:47:23.917 --> 00:47:28.041
with my case and everything
that had gone wrong.

00:47:28.041 --> 00:47:28.500
If you further t

00:47:28.542 --> 00:47:30.333
he
conspiracy one step,

00:47:30.333 --> 00:47:32.999
you\'re guilty for
everything in the conspiracy

00:47:32.999 --> 00:47:34.834
no matter when you
entered the conspiracy.

00:47:34.834 --> 00:47:37.166
It could have been
on the last day.

00:47:37.166 --> 00:47:40.917
So because I had
collected some money,

00:47:40.917 --> 00:47:44.709
I technically was
guilty of conspiracy

00:47:44.709 --> 00:47:47.999
and was held responsible
for everything

00:47:47.999 --> 00:47:49.792
that everybody else had done.

00:47:49.792 --> 00:47:54.458
And my sentence, my 24
years, was established

00:47:54.458 --> 00:47:59.041
based on the sum total of
all the ecstasy that Sandy

00:47:59.041 --> 00:48:00.417
had manufactured.

00:48:00.417 --> 00:48:02.333
That\'s where my years came from.

00:48:02.333 --> 00:48:05.083
My years didn\'t come
from things that I did.

00:48:05.083 --> 00:48:10.208
It came from 3 point something
million tablets of ecstasy

00:48:10.208 --> 00:48:14.834
that he had manufactured puts
me on the chart at this level,

00:48:14.834 --> 00:48:15.917
which is 24 years.

00:48:15.917 --> 00:48:18.999
That\'s how a judge sentences
you, based on a chart.

00:48:18.999 --> 00:48:19.792
You end up being subject...
The

00:48:19.792 --> 00:48:22.667
way the sentencing laws

00:48:22.667 --> 00:48:25.917
apply to conspiracy,
you end up being

00:48:25.917 --> 00:48:29.291
subject to being punished
for all the conduct

00:48:29.291 --> 00:48:33.999
that everybody in the
conspiracy has been involved in.

00:48:33.999 --> 00:48:38.417
So the idea of
proportional punishment

00:48:38.417 --> 00:48:43.166
can be lost if this triggers
a mandatory sentence.

00:48:43.166 --> 00:48:43.959
One of the most controversial

00:48:43.959 --> 00:48:45.542
things about the way

00:48:45.542 --> 00:48:47.917
the federal criminal
justice system works

00:48:47.917 --> 00:48:50.542
now is something called
the trial penalty.

00:48:50.542 --> 00:48:53.917
And so it\'s just become standard
practice that a prosecutor will

00:48:53.917 --> 00:48:56.250
go to a defendant
and say, you\'ve

00:48:56.250 --> 00:48:58.041
been charged with a
crime and you\'re either

00:48:58.041 --> 00:48:59.999
going to plead
guilty and cooperate

00:48:59.999 --> 00:49:02.000
or we\'re going to crush you.

00:49:02.000 --> 00:49:05.583
And so the defendant
is confronted

00:49:05.583 --> 00:49:08.166
with a favorable offer
for a plea agreement

00:49:08.166 --> 00:49:12.166
if he pleads guilty and
potentially, decades in prison

00:49:12.166 --> 00:49:14.417
if he exercises his
constitutional right to go

00:49:14.417 --> 00:49:20.458
to trial because he\'s not going
to get any credit for accepting

00:49:20.458 --> 00:49:22.500
responsibility if
he goes to trial.

00:49:22.500 --> 00:49:24.250
Prosecutors have a
lot of discretion

00:49:24.250 --> 00:49:26.250
to add charges to people.

00:49:26.250 --> 00:49:28.125
This falls under the
category of, like,

00:49:28.125 --> 00:49:30.125
throwing the book at somebody.

00:49:30.125 --> 00:49:32.208
Sometimes they have
that discretion

00:49:32.208 --> 00:49:37.208
and they do not want people
exercising their right

00:49:37.208 --> 00:49:38.291
to a jury trial.

00:49:38.291 --> 00:49:41.125
So they will threaten
people and the courts

00:49:41.125 --> 00:49:42.709
have upheld this tactic.

00:49:42.709 --> 00:49:45.834
It\'s not like they\'re doing
something under the table.

00:49:45.834 --> 00:49:49.291
But if people insist on
their right to a jury trial,

00:49:49.291 --> 00:49:53.000
they face the prospect
of the judge imposing

00:49:53.000 --> 00:49:56.999
a mandatory minimum sentence or
the prosecutors adding charges.

00:49:56.999 --> 00:49:58.999
And that\'s the type of
pressure that they face

00:49:58.999 --> 00:50:01.500
and why so many do plead guilty.

00:50:01.500 --> 00:50:02.041
To add insult to injury, while

00:50:02.041 --> 00:50:06.417
I\'m incarcerated for 24 years,

00:50:06.417 --> 00:50:10.041
he comes back to the US and
goes before the same judge that

00:50:10.041 --> 00:50:14.458
sentenced me to 24 years and
he got three years probation

00:50:14.458 --> 00:50:19.625
because he cooperated and
snitched out everybody.

00:50:20.375 --> 00:50:24.125
The person who comes
in early and cooperates

00:50:24.125 --> 00:50:26.999
usually ends up with
a lower sentence

00:50:26.999 --> 00:50:29.000
than the person in
the conspiracy who

00:50:29.000 --> 00:50:32.999
walks up two days before the
trial and tenders a plea.

00:50:32.999 --> 00:50:34.375
That sentence will be different.

00:50:34.375 --> 00:50:36.417
Even though they may
be situated the same,

00:50:36.417 --> 00:50:38.834
it\'s just plain different.

00:50:38.834 --> 00:50:42.959
And those are the yins and the
yangs of the sentencing process

00:50:42.959 --> 00:50:45.834
that the court has not a
whole lot of control over

00:50:45.834 --> 00:50:47.917
and the US attorneys and
the prosecuting attorneys

00:50:47.917 --> 00:50:49.583
have control over.

00:50:49.583 --> 00:50:51.375
But it does result in
a different sentence.

00:50:51.375 --> 00:50:57.333
When you are facing a mandatory
minimum drug sentence,

00:50:57.333 --> 00:51:00.999
there is only one way out.

00:51:00.999 --> 00:51:03.959
You must offer
substantial assistance

00:51:03.959 --> 00:51:09.208
to the government in the
prosecution of someone else.

00:51:09.208 --> 00:51:11.875
That means you\'ve got to
work for the government.

00:51:11.875 --> 00:51:14.125
It means you\'ve got to
set up someone else.

00:51:14.125 --> 00:51:17.166
You need to give information
to the government that leads

00:51:17.166 --> 00:51:19.917
to the prosecution of others.

00:51:19.917 --> 00:51:20.208
When you\'re facing s

00:51:20.250 --> 00:51:23.999
omething
like 20 or 30 years,

00:51:23.999 --> 00:51:28.166
you have people that
do things they never

00:51:28.166 --> 00:51:31.542
thought they would do, which
is turn in their friends,

00:51:31.542 --> 00:51:33.166
testify against friends.

00:51:33.166 --> 00:51:37.959
Sometimes they will even
make up false information

00:51:37.959 --> 00:51:40.792
to testify falsely
against people just

00:51:40.792 --> 00:51:43.999
in order to get themselves out
from under the terrible legal

00:51:43.999 --> 00:51:45.999
situation that they are in.

00:51:45.999 --> 00:51:47.999
The pressure to
provide information

00:51:47.999 --> 00:51:53.999
is huge and coercive
and un-American

00:51:53.999 --> 00:51:54.000
but th

00:51:54.041 --> 00:51:57.834
at\'s the way mandatory
minimums are set up.

00:51:57.917 --> 00:52:00.458
My mother calls me
and she said, well, I

00:52:00.458 --> 00:52:04.999
need to tell you something
and I\'m thinking the worst.

00:52:04.999 --> 00:52:08.542
She said, well, Amy is
featured in Glamour magazine.

00:52:08.542 --> 00:52:11.834
She\'s been in prison
for a number of years.

00:52:11.834 --> 00:52:15.875
And why that was such a
catalyst was suddenly,

00:52:15.875 --> 00:52:18.999
we had something tangible
to hand to people.

00:52:18.999 --> 00:52:20.875
The community found
out and my brother

00:52:20.875 --> 00:52:23.417
got involved and of course,
my father and Senator

00:52:23.417 --> 00:52:24.999
Bumpers and Senator Pryor.

00:52:24.999 --> 00:52:27.999
And everyone started actually
looking into the case

00:52:27.999 --> 00:52:31.083
and saying, well, what could
have possibly happened here?

00:52:31.083 --> 00:52:34.709
This just doesn\'t seem right.

00:52:34.709 --> 00:52:39.000
My story and case started
gaining momentum, and we got,

00:52:39.000 --> 00:52:42.375
I think, up to 15
politicians who wrote letters

00:52:42.375 --> 00:52:44.667
supporting my clemency.

00:52:44.667 --> 00:52:49.917
When I read it, I was
sympathetic to her

00:52:49.917 --> 00:52:56.208
because I thought that her
husband was the primary driver

00:52:56.208 --> 00:52:57.041
of the offense.

00:52:57.041 --> 00:53:00.417
She clearly had a subordinate
role in the offense.

00:53:00.417 --> 00:53:05.709
And she was caught up in
the web of these conspiracy

00:53:05.709 --> 00:53:09.375
laws that are
extremely broad ranging

00:53:09.375 --> 00:53:12.500
and you don\'t have to do
very much to get yourself

00:53:12.500 --> 00:53:14.375
stuck in a case like that.

00:53:14.375 --> 00:53:15.250
I went to my case manager\'s
office and wal

00:53:15.250 --> 00:53:17.000
ked in the door,

00:53:17.000 --> 00:53:20.333
and she said... she
was in a frenzy

00:53:20.333 --> 00:53:24.999
and she said, you know, where
are you going to release to?

00:53:24.999 --> 00:53:26.875
And I was, like,
what do you mean?

00:53:26.875 --> 00:53:28.417
And she said, where
are you going to live

00:53:28.417 --> 00:53:29.750
when you get out of prison?

00:53:29.750 --> 00:53:31.999
And I said, well, I guess
with my parents for a while.

00:53:31.999 --> 00:53:34.709
And she said, because I\'ve got
to set you up on probation.

00:53:34.709 --> 00:53:35.542
And I said, why?

00:53:35.542 --> 00:53:39.083
And she said, you\'re going home.

00:53:39.083 --> 00:53:42.375
And I couldn\'t process it.

00:53:42.375 --> 00:53:45.583
I was just like...

00:53:45.999 --> 00:53:51.959
And so my reaction was... I
think I was sitting down.

00:53:51.959 --> 00:53:53.917
So I stood up and then I
sat down, then I stood up

00:53:53.917 --> 00:53:55.000
and I sat down.

00:53:55.000 --> 00:53:56.625
And I said, well,
what do you mean?

00:53:56.625 --> 00:54:00.208
She said you\'ve gotten
executive clemency.

00:54:00.208 --> 00:54:02.083
President Clinton
has ordered you out

00:54:02.083 --> 00:54:04.999
and you have to be out
today by five o\'clock.

00:54:04.999 --> 00:54:06.667
The President had
granted her petition

00:54:06.667 --> 00:54:08.917
and she was home that
afternoon, that evening.

00:54:08.917 --> 00:54:10.375
They let her out that day.

00:54:10.375 --> 00:54:14.750
It was really great because we
always got bad news in there.

00:54:14.750 --> 00:54:16.542
Nobody ever got good news.

00:54:16.542 --> 00:54:20.417
And it was really nice to
have all the women walk me

00:54:20.417 --> 00:54:22.083
across the compound.

00:54:22.083 --> 00:54:25.999
And there was that moment
on the compound of victory

00:54:25.999 --> 00:54:29.999
but it was really hard, too,
because you have to leave,

00:54:29.999 --> 00:54:34.208
you have to leave so
many people behind.

00:54:35.625 --> 00:54:39.250
We can confidently say today
that we are finally beginning

00:54:39.250 --> 00:54:42.667
to win the war against crime.

00:54:42.667 --> 00:54:42.999
Now is the tim

00:54:42.999 --> 00:54:44.417
e
to show drug users

00:54:44.417 --> 00:54:48.959
that we mean to reach our
goal of a drug-free generation

00:54:48.959 --> 00:54:50.291
in the United States.

00:54:50.291 --> 00:54:53.166
You will be put away
and put away for good.

00:54:53.166 --> 00:54:56.999
Three strikes and you are out.

00:54:56.999 --> 00:54:59.667
The primary mission
of the drug war,

00:54:59.667 --> 00:55:01.999
as stated by the
Nixon administration,

00:55:01.999 --> 00:55:04.999
is to create a
drug-free society.

00:55:05.750 --> 00:55:07.333
That\'s what it\'s all about.

00:55:07.333 --> 00:55:09.750
That\'s why we spend
the billions of dollars

00:55:09.750 --> 00:55:12.250
and incarcerate
millions of people

00:55:12.250 --> 00:55:15.417
is to create a
drug-free society.

00:55:15.500 --> 00:55:18.999
And we\'ve been at this now
good and hard for 40 years,

00:55:18.999 --> 00:55:23.125
trillions of dollars into
it, no end in sight really,

00:55:23.125 --> 00:55:25.959
and when a reasonable
person says

00:55:25.959 --> 00:55:30.709
how much closer are we to
creating a drug-free society?

00:55:30.834 --> 00:55:32.583
You begin to realize
that perhaps we\'ve

00:55:32.583 --> 00:55:35.583
been given a mission here
that is impossible to achieve.

00:55:35.583 --> 00:55:35.999
As we released
thes

00:55:35.999 --> 00:55:36.999
e drug laws, we

00:55:36.999 --> 00:55:38.834
went out and arrested
anyone we could

00:55:38.834 --> 00:55:41.959
find who were either using
drugs or selling drugs.

00:55:41.959 --> 00:55:44.834
And you try to personally
remove yourself from that.

00:55:44.834 --> 00:55:45.999
No, this is just our job.

00:55:45.999 --> 00:55:47.417
This is what we do.

00:55:47.417 --> 00:55:51.166
And we have no idea of how
we\'re affecting society.

00:55:51.166 --> 00:55:52.542
You don\'t think about that.

00:55:52.542 --> 00:55:53.000
It lines up perfectly

00:55:53.000 --> 00:55:54.999
with alcohol prohibition.

00:55:54.999 --> 00:55:56.542
When you look at
alcohol prohibition,

00:55:56.542 --> 00:55:58.999
the richest man in the
country was Al Capone.

00:55:58.999 --> 00:55:59.917
He controlled it.

00:55:59.917 --> 00:56:03.000
If you tried to get into this
market, he would kill you.

00:56:03.000 --> 00:56:05.917
There were also kinds
of sub-factions.

00:56:05.917 --> 00:56:06.542
They tried to manufacture it
in t

00:56:06.583 --> 00:56:09.458
heir bathtubs, in stills.

00:56:09.458 --> 00:56:10.458
It was unsanitary.

00:56:10.458 --> 00:56:10.834
You didn\'t k

00:56:10.875 --> 00:56:11.750
now what
it was cut with.

00:56:11.750 --> 00:56:13.542
Sometimes it had anti-freeze.

00:56:13.542 --> 00:56:14.999
People would drink
this and go blind.

00:56:14.999 --> 00:56:17.667
People would drink
it and get cirrhosis.

00:56:17.667 --> 00:56:20.166
Kids would die in the crossfire.

00:56:20.166 --> 00:56:22.125
It sounds all too
familiar because it\'s

00:56:22.125 --> 00:56:24.166
exactly what\'s
happening on the streets

00:56:24.166 --> 00:56:26.667
today in the United States
when it comes to gang

00:56:26.667 --> 00:56:27.999
violence and the drug war.

00:56:27.999 --> 00:56:28.917
The DEA has said the majority
of gan

00:56:28.917 --> 00:56:30.999
g violence in the United

00:56:30.999 --> 00:56:35.999
States is over illegal
drug marketplace disputes,

00:56:36.208 --> 00:56:37.750
fighting for that territory.

00:56:37.750 --> 00:56:38.375
We saw violent crimes
go throu

00:56:38.375 --> 00:56:40.125
gh the roof

00:56:40.125 --> 00:56:43.999
as these criminal gangster
organizations fought

00:56:43.999 --> 00:56:44.625
one another.

00:56:44.625 --> 00:56:47.999
So we\'re seeing that
type of phenomenon today

00:56:47.999 --> 00:56:51.834
in our major metropolitan
areas like Los Angeles,

00:56:51.834 --> 00:56:53.000
the Crips against the Bloods.

00:56:53.000 --> 00:56:55.417
And of course, the
horrendous violence

00:56:55.417 --> 00:56:58.417
that we\'re seeing
in Mexico and places

00:56:58.417 --> 00:57:02.667
like South America as these
very rich, powerful cartels

00:57:02.667 --> 00:57:04.333
fight one another.

00:57:04.333 --> 00:57:04.792
As a police of

00:57:04.792 --> 00:57:06.999
ficer
for many years,

00:57:06.999 --> 00:57:08.999
I policed and really
thought nothing

00:57:08.999 --> 00:57:12.291
about the effects of my work.

00:57:12.291 --> 00:57:14.999
But when I retired from the
Maryland State Police in 1999

00:57:14.999 --> 00:57:17.959
and started working for the
Baltimore Police Department

00:57:17.959 --> 00:57:18.999
as a commander-in-training.

00:57:18.999 --> 00:57:20.583
That very year, I
had a good friend

00:57:20.583 --> 00:57:23.000
of mine, Ed Totly, who
was working undercover

00:57:23.000 --> 00:57:25.166
for the Maryland State Police.

00:57:25.166 --> 00:57:26.999
He was working on a
Safe Streets campaign

00:57:26.999 --> 00:57:29.000
with the FBI on a
task force and he

00:57:29.000 --> 00:57:31.166
was assassinated
by a drug dealer

00:57:31.166 --> 00:57:33.792
where he was buying
cocaine from.

00:57:33.792 --> 00:57:35.458
That made me stop and
think for a while.

00:57:35.458 --> 00:57:38.875
It drew me right to the
violence of this business.

00:57:38.999 --> 00:57:41.834
A lot of people blame drugs
and not prohibition when

00:57:41.834 --> 00:57:44.999
this is really the
problems, the violence

00:57:44.999 --> 00:57:48.750
around drugs, what is destroying
cities and communities

00:57:48.750 --> 00:57:51.083
is much more prohibition
than it is the actual drug.

00:57:51.083 --> 00:57:53.333
One of the problems that we
have with drug prohibition

00:57:53.333 --> 00:57:55.500
is that it\'s so
lucrative of a business.

00:57:55.500 --> 00:57:58.583
You can make so much
money in such little time.

00:57:58.583 --> 00:58:01.208
And the difference
between arresting someone

00:58:01.208 --> 00:58:03.417
for dealing drugs
and arresting someone

00:58:03.417 --> 00:58:06.250
for committing rapes or
burglaries, when you arrest

00:58:06.250 --> 00:58:08.709
a rapist or someone
committing burglaries,

00:58:08.709 --> 00:58:12.750
you know what, the rapes
stop, the burglaries stop.

00:58:12.750 --> 00:58:15.291
When you arrest someone
for dealing drugs,

00:58:15.291 --> 00:58:18.917
dealing drugs doesn\'t
stop on that corner.

00:58:18.917 --> 00:58:20.999
You just create a job
opportunity for someone else

00:58:20.999 --> 00:58:24.917
to come in and unfortunately,
when that job is filled,

00:58:24.917 --> 00:58:26.500
there\'s usually some
fighting going on,

00:58:26.500 --> 00:58:29.999
some shooting and
people get hurt.

00:58:29.999 --> 00:58:30.375
Drug enforcement

00:58:30.417 --> 00:58:35.667
is
relatively an easier kind

00:58:35.667 --> 00:58:40.417
of crime to prosecute because
the government gets to control

00:58:40.417 --> 00:58:42.750
the commission of the crime.

00:58:42.750 --> 00:58:42.999
You pick

00:58:42.999 --> 00:58:43.999
your target.

00:58:43.999 --> 00:58:46.542
You trick them when to show up.

00:58:46.542 --> 00:58:50.458
If you\'re the government, you
actually maybe provide drugs

00:58:50.458 --> 00:58:52.999
to the case.

00:58:52.999 --> 00:58:57.999
Ordinary kinds of crime,
you\'ve got to investigate

00:58:58.083 --> 00:58:59.792
what happened, who did it?

00:58:59.792 --> 00:59:04.125
You\'ve got to gather evidence
sometime after it happened.

00:59:04.125 --> 00:59:09.166
So that the challenge of
investigating robbery, murder,

00:59:09.166 --> 00:59:13.417
burglary, those take
lots of resources

00:59:13.999 --> 00:59:17.166
and there\'s much lower return.

00:59:17.709 --> 00:59:19.583
You can do lots and
lots of investigations

00:59:19.583 --> 00:59:21.959
and never find the target.

00:59:21.959 --> 00:59:24.667
We evaluate you as
a police officer

00:59:24.667 --> 00:59:27.458
many times on the number
of arrests that you make.

00:59:27.458 --> 00:59:29.083
So the more arrests
that you make,

00:59:29.083 --> 00:59:30.667
the better your evaluation.

00:59:30.667 --> 00:59:32.999
The better your valuation, the
quicker you\'re going to get

00:59:32.999 --> 00:59:33.875
promoted.

00:59:33.875 --> 00:59:36.458
Also, if you\'re out
there making arrests,

00:59:36.458 --> 00:59:37.999
you can work more overtime.

00:59:37.999 --> 00:59:40.875
You work more overtime,
you get more money.

00:59:40.875 --> 00:59:44.750
It\'s very easy to make
large numbers of arrests

00:59:44.750 --> 00:59:48.166
in black and poor communities
because the drug dealing

00:59:48.166 --> 00:59:51.333
occurs on the street
corners out in the open.

00:59:51.333 --> 00:59:54.041
And it\'s very easy
for anyone to go in,

00:59:54.041 --> 00:59:57.458
any police officer to go in and
just scoop up a large number

00:59:57.458 --> 00:59:59.458
of people on any given day.

00:59:59.458 --> 01:00:03.959
We need to change the incentives
for our police officers.

01:00:03.959 --> 01:00:06.542
The other piece of it
is with drug cases,

01:00:06.542 --> 01:00:08.500
there\'s asset forfeiture.

01:00:08.500 --> 01:00:10.999
You can get all
the property that\'s

01:00:10.999 --> 01:00:15.041
associated with the drug
trafficking offense, the cars,

01:00:15.041 --> 01:00:17.291
the real estate, the airplanes.

01:00:17.291 --> 01:00:20.999
And that money goes into
your agency\'s budget.

01:00:20.999 --> 01:00:24.959
So you get a very powerful
economic incentive

01:00:24.959 --> 01:00:28.917
to do this kind of work,
especially when times are hard.

01:00:28.917 --> 01:00:29.041
The emphasis

01:00:29.083 --> 01:00:31.166
of our
criminal justice system

01:00:31.166 --> 01:00:33.166
should be on violent offenses.

01:00:33.166 --> 01:00:36.709
This is what most people
are concerned about.

01:00:36.709 --> 01:00:38.999
They want murderers apprehended.

01:00:38.999 --> 01:00:41.375
They want murders
and rapes solved

01:00:41.375 --> 01:00:44.667
and they want these people
taken out of the community

01:00:44.667 --> 01:00:47.875
and locked away in prison
so that our communities can

01:00:47.875 --> 01:00:48.667
be safe.

01:00:48.667 --> 01:00:50.834
I think a significant
problem in policing

01:00:50.834 --> 01:00:53.750
is the limited
resources that we have.

01:00:53.750 --> 01:00:57.041
And if you look at the
data in the late 1960s

01:00:57.041 --> 01:01:00.917
before the drug war, we were
solving nine out of 10 murders

01:01:00.917 --> 01:01:01.999
in this country.

01:01:01.999 --> 01:01:04.792
We made arrests for nine out
of 10 murders in this country.

01:01:04.792 --> 01:01:06.999
Today, that number
is six out of 10,

01:01:06.999 --> 01:01:09.625
and those numbers are similar
for other violent crimes,

01:01:09.625 --> 01:01:12.125
such as rapes and robberies.

01:01:12.125 --> 01:01:14.083
And we know it\'s
directly related

01:01:14.083 --> 01:01:19.417
to us being misdirected within
the law enforcement community

01:01:19.417 --> 01:01:22.583
and focusing on drug crimes.

01:01:22.583 --> 01:01:24.625
I mean, we have
better technology.

01:01:24.625 --> 01:01:25.542
We have computers.

01:01:25.542 --> 01:01:26.999
We have DNA.

01:01:26.999 --> 01:01:28.583
We should be solving
more murders.

01:01:28.583 --> 01:01:30.917
We should be better at that.

01:01:30.917 --> 01:01:32.500
Another significant
piece here is

01:01:32.500 --> 01:01:34.999
that the relationship
between police and community

01:01:34.999 --> 01:01:35.999
has been broken.

01:01:35.999 --> 01:01:38.166
It\'s severely broken
and that\'s because we\'ve

01:01:38.166 --> 01:01:40.583
go into these communities
looking for drugs everyday.

01:01:40.583 --> 01:01:43.750
It\'s 70% of what we
do everyday, illegally

01:01:43.750 --> 01:01:47.333
searching people, searching
their cars, racial profiling.

01:01:47.333 --> 01:01:49.917
And because of this
conflict, we don\'t

01:01:49.917 --> 01:01:55.625
get the information we need from
the community to solve crimes.

01:01:55.625 --> 01:01:55.959
Any police

01:01:55.999 --> 01:01:58.999
officer, any chief
who knows his business will

01:01:58.999 --> 01:02:01.792
tell you that we cannot
be effective in preventing

01:02:01.792 --> 01:02:05.458
and solving crime without the
cooperation of the community.

01:02:05.458 --> 01:02:08.542
We\'ve lost it completely.

01:02:08.542 --> 01:02:08.999
So I was a colonel

01:02:08.999 --> 01:02:11.959
in the
war on drugs during the 1980s

01:02:11.959 --> 01:02:14.333
when I worked for
the US Congress

01:02:14.333 --> 01:02:16.500
writing these drug laws,
overseeing the Drug Enforcement

01:02:16.500 --> 01:02:18.000
writing these drug laws,
overseeing the Drug Enforcement

01:02:18.000 --> 01:02:21.792
Administration, going to their
secret intelligence center,

01:02:21.792 --> 01:02:26.542
going to their laboratories,
watching what they were doing.

01:02:26.999 --> 01:02:28.792
And at a certain time
you begin to say,

01:02:28.792 --> 01:02:32.083
is this strategy
capable of working?

01:02:32.083 --> 01:02:32.333
Are

01:02:32.333 --> 01:02:36.917
we going to stop
the drug traffickers?

01:02:36.917 --> 01:02:39.625
Well, it\'s many years later
and the answer is clearly

01:02:39.625 --> 01:02:41.250
we have not.

01:02:41.250 --> 01:02:45.500
You look at Mexico and the drug
traffickers are running amok.

01:02:45.500 --> 01:02:48.750
You look at the headlines and
we\'re having heroin overdose

01:02:48.750 --> 01:02:49.750
epidemic.

01:02:49.750 --> 01:02:52.208
It\'s worse than it\'s ever been.

01:02:53.999 --> 01:02:56.875
What we\'ve been
doing is not working

01:02:56.875 --> 01:02:59.834
and I would suggest
it can\'t work.

01:02:59.834 --> 01:03:02.999
It can\'t work for a very
important economic reason,

01:03:02.999 --> 01:03:07.542
which is that the harder you
squeeze the drug traffickers

01:03:07.542 --> 01:03:11.542
and try to create a scarcity,
the more valuable you

01:03:11.542 --> 01:03:12.458
make the drugs.

01:03:12.458 --> 01:03:15.125
And the more valuable you
make the drugs, the more

01:03:15.125 --> 01:03:17.999
people who will come in
to make those profits.

01:03:17.999 --> 01:03:19.999
If the price of
anything goes up,

01:03:19.999 --> 01:03:22.208
more people are
going to go into it.

01:03:22.208 --> 01:03:23.999
So that the very
economics of what you\'re

01:03:23.999 --> 01:03:27.083
trying to accomplish
guarantees more people

01:03:27.083 --> 01:03:28.667
are going to sell drugs.

01:03:28.667 --> 01:03:30.333
It\'s illogical.

01:03:30.333 --> 01:03:32.250
It\'s fundamentally illogical.

01:03:32.250 --> 01:03:36.375
It\'s irrational to think
that drug enforcement can

01:03:36.375 --> 01:03:38.999
stop the supply of
drugs because it doesn\'t

01:03:38.999 --> 01:03:40.917
make any economic sense.

01:03:40.917 --> 01:03:42.999
I don\'t know what the criminal
justice world would be

01:03:42.999 --> 01:03:45.999
like without the war on drugs.

01:03:45.999 --> 01:03:50.999
My only experience of it has
been during the war on drugs.

01:03:51.959 --> 01:03:54.875
I mean, I started FAMM in 1991.

01:03:54.875 --> 01:03:57.750
The war on drugs really
heated up in the \'80s,

01:03:57.750 --> 01:04:00.542
kept rolling through the \'90s.

01:04:00.542 --> 01:04:03.709
It sort of started
tapering off in the 2000s

01:04:03.709 --> 01:04:06.625
but it\'s still alive and well.

01:04:06.625 --> 01:04:13.166
It was like a pounding thunder
of anti-drug hysteria in 1986.

01:04:13.166 --> 01:04:16.083
We must do something, anything.

01:04:16.083 --> 01:04:18.208
And that meant
grasping at straws

01:04:18.208 --> 01:04:20.999
and not looking ahead at what
the costs are going to be

01:04:20.999 --> 01:04:22.999
or what might be effective.

01:04:23.083 --> 01:04:25.000
While I was on the
Hill, I increasingly

01:04:25.000 --> 01:04:28.333
became convinced that the
war on drugs was a mistake.

01:04:28.333 --> 01:04:32.999
It was counterproductive
and I wanted

01:04:32.999 --> 01:04:35.709
to put my energy into ending it.

01:04:35.709 --> 01:04:39.959
And so in January 1989 I started
the Criminal Justice Policy

01:04:39.959 --> 01:04:44.250
Foundation and that has
been the opportunity for me

01:04:44.250 --> 01:04:49.458
for the last 25
years to mobilize

01:04:49.458 --> 01:04:52.583
different kinds of strategies
to end drug prohibition.

01:04:52.583 --> 01:04:54.959
A lot of it has been
through other organizations.

01:04:54.959 --> 01:04:58.999
I helped start Families
Against Mandatory Minimums

01:04:58.999 --> 01:05:00.999
in my office.

01:05:00.999 --> 01:05:03.959
I\'m still very active with
Students for Sensible Drug

01:05:03.959 --> 01:05:09.375
Policy and with Law Enforcement
Against Prohibition.

01:05:09.375 --> 01:05:13.999
And so a lot of my
work is advocacy,

01:05:13.999 --> 01:05:18.333
strategizing what are
the ways to change

01:05:18.333 --> 01:05:22.208
drug policy and reform the
criminal justice system?

01:05:22.375 --> 01:05:26.375
There are countless
numbers of people

01:05:26.375 --> 01:05:32.291
who are in prison for
inconceivably long sentences

01:05:32.291 --> 01:05:37.999
for being minor, minor
offenders in the drug trade.

01:05:37.999 --> 01:05:41.667
These are just a
handful of files

01:05:41.667 --> 01:05:44.792
from Families Against
Mandatory Minimums,

01:05:44.792 --> 01:05:49.542
where these people, Jane
Felt, life sentence.

01:05:49.542 --> 01:05:52.083
Danelle Clark, 35 years.

01:05:52.083 --> 01:05:55.208
Timothy Tyler, life sentence.

01:05:55.208 --> 01:05:58.417
Shironda Jones, life sentence.

01:05:59.166 --> 01:06:01.291
This is not an aberration.

01:06:01.291 --> 01:06:03.999
This is the lifeblood.

01:06:03.999 --> 01:06:05.999
This is the typical case.

01:06:05.999 --> 01:06:07.999
This is the typical pattern.

01:06:07.999 --> 01:06:09.250
Clarence Aaron, who\'s out.

01:06:09.250 --> 01:06:13.458
Numerous cases, I mean, these
are all excessively long cases.

01:06:13.458 --> 01:06:16.333
These are... do you see
Colombian drug lords here?

01:06:16.333 --> 01:06:20.667
Do you see Mexico... Chapo
Guzman, do you see
the Mexican drug

01:06:20.667 --> 01:06:21.834
lords here?

01:06:21.959 --> 01:06:22.999
No.

01:06:28.125 --> 01:06:34.959
I was so glad to start to
work my way out of the prison.

01:06:34.959 --> 01:06:37.458
So going to Clinton House,
was a halfway house.

01:06:37.458 --> 01:06:41.000
You were halfway home but
you were still in prison.

01:06:41.999 --> 01:06:45.291
So when I got to
Clinton House, I already

01:06:45.291 --> 01:06:46.959
had some experience
in doing roofing.

01:06:46.959 --> 01:06:49.417
I had a roofing background.

01:06:49.417 --> 01:06:50.792
I called my old boss up.

01:06:50.792 --> 01:06:55.417
He was in the halfway house at
the time and I think someone,

01:06:55.417 --> 01:06:58.208
I don\'t know what company
had him doing roofing,

01:06:58.208 --> 01:07:00.125
and his mother came
to me and asked

01:07:00.125 --> 01:07:03.041
me would I buy him
a pair of shoes

01:07:03.041 --> 01:07:07.166
that he needed to do his
roofing and he just blossomed.

01:07:07.166 --> 01:07:09.542
He just blossomed from there.

01:07:09.542 --> 01:07:10.291
When I came out of prison
and had a

01:07:10.291 --> 01:07:14.291
job and he says,

01:07:14.625 --> 01:07:15.208
hey, Cuz.

01:07:15.208 --> 01:07:15.834
He came by.

01:07:15.834 --> 01:07:16.999
Man, nice to see you home.

01:07:16.999 --> 01:07:18.125
And I said, yeah, you know.

01:07:18.125 --> 01:07:19.999
All the time, my
mind was thinking,

01:07:19.999 --> 01:07:23.542
maybe I can get me some money
because I heard he got a job.

01:07:23.542 --> 01:07:26.333
I\'ll get me some money and
I can get up and running.

01:07:26.500 --> 01:07:30.750
But me, with that
old stinking thinking

01:07:30.959 --> 01:07:35.375
was trying to get him to come
in because I can\'t trust nobody.

01:07:35.375 --> 01:07:35.834
He said, man, I\'

01:07:35.875 --> 01:07:38.999
m not
living like that no more.

01:07:38.999 --> 01:07:39.583
And I really didn\'t believe that

01:07:39.625 --> 01:07:43.208
because I couldn\'t see myself

01:07:43.208 --> 01:07:45.000
disconnecting myself from it.

01:07:45.000 --> 01:07:47.166
So I couldn\'t believe
it for nobody else.

01:07:47.166 --> 01:07:49.583
But he showed me.

01:07:49.999 --> 01:07:50.999
He didn\'t tell me.

01:07:50.999 --> 01:07:52.959
He showed me.

01:07:52.959 --> 01:07:56.999
He stayed loyal and
cut it out for real.

01:07:56.999 --> 01:07:57.083
And th

01:07:57.083 --> 01:07:59.458
at\'s what I admired
him most about it because he

01:07:59.458 --> 01:08:02.208
was in a bad place like I was.

01:08:02.208 --> 01:08:02.917
I was so happy to be at work a

01:08:02.959 --> 01:08:06.291
nd
have the ability to work again

01:08:06.291 --> 01:08:07.667
that I never missed a day.

01:08:07.667 --> 01:08:08.792
I was always there.

01:08:08.792 --> 01:08:10.208
I was always there
an hour early,

01:08:10.208 --> 01:08:13.041
before anybody else get there.

01:08:14.083 --> 01:08:15.834
So in essence, I was hungry.

01:08:15.834 --> 01:08:21.709
I was hungry to work, I was
hungry to be free, and have

01:08:21.709 --> 01:08:23.333
the ability to change
my life around.

01:08:23.333 --> 01:08:28.458
So all those things
made me a good employee

01:08:28.458 --> 01:08:31.999
and I think he seen that in me.

01:08:31.999 --> 01:08:35.667
And he allowed me to work
my way up from laborer

01:08:35.667 --> 01:08:38.583
to mechanic to
foreman to supervisor

01:08:38.583 --> 01:08:41.333
within a matter
of a couple years.

01:08:41.333 --> 01:08:43.250
And that\'s when he
just made his mind up

01:08:43.250 --> 01:08:47.291
and said that he was going to
go into business for himself.

01:08:47.291 --> 01:08:48.999
And that\'s how it all started.

01:08:48.999 --> 01:08:51.166
I just really felt
that I had what

01:08:51.166 --> 01:08:55.625
it took to be an entrepreneur
and to be successful.

01:08:56.083 --> 01:09:00.208
So I quit my job and I was
fully fledged into business.

01:09:00.208 --> 01:09:03.125
And I believe my first
year in business,

01:09:03.125 --> 01:09:05.875
I made about 30-something
thousand dollars

01:09:05.875 --> 01:09:07.542
in my first year.

01:09:08.333 --> 01:09:11.917
I remember investing back into
the business and buying tools

01:09:11.917 --> 01:09:13.709
and buying ladders.

01:09:13.709 --> 01:09:15.166
So I\'m growing
the business and I

01:09:15.166 --> 01:09:16.999
think my second
year I probably did

01:09:16.999 --> 01:09:19.125
about 80-something thousand.

01:09:19.125 --> 01:09:19.500
Third year I

01:09:19.542 --> 01:09:21.999
did about
100-something thousand.

01:09:21.999 --> 01:09:24.999
So I\'m slowly but
surely progressing.

01:09:24.999 --> 01:09:28.375
So now, I\'m up to half a
million dollars a year.

01:09:28.375 --> 01:09:31.999
The next thing you know,
I\'m up to $700,000 a year.

01:09:31.999 --> 01:09:37.792
And in early 1999,
early 2000, I finally

01:09:37.792 --> 01:09:40.041
went over the
million dollar mark.

01:09:40.041 --> 01:09:44.208
And I said, wow, I never
thought that I would

01:09:44.208 --> 01:09:46.999
own a million dollar business.

01:09:47.125 --> 01:09:50.333
A person has to have a dream.

01:09:50.333 --> 01:09:53.417
They have to want to do
better for themselves.

01:09:53.417 --> 01:09:56.583
You can bring a
person out of prison

01:09:56.583 --> 01:09:58.834
and they can have
nothing and they

01:09:58.834 --> 01:10:02.583
can make something of themselves
if that\'s what they want.

01:10:02.792 --> 01:10:05.750
But if you have low
self-esteem, you

01:10:05.750 --> 01:10:07.917
don\'t think good about yourself.

01:10:07.917 --> 01:10:10.999
So when you come out, you\'re
not going to think good,

01:10:10.999 --> 01:10:12.999
so you\'re not going
to get better.

01:10:12.999 --> 01:10:16.041
So when you start thinking
that I\'m better than this,

01:10:16.041 --> 01:10:20.417
then that\'s when you can
overcome the obstacles that

01:10:20.417 --> 01:10:22.000
are in your way
at the time that\'s

01:10:22.000 --> 01:10:24.166
blocking you from a dream.

01:10:24.166 --> 01:10:25.999
But you have to have that dream.

01:10:25.999 --> 01:10:28.999
You have to want
better for yourself

01:10:28.999 --> 01:10:32.875
and that\'s hard for people
that are coming out of prison.

01:10:32.875 --> 01:10:33.333
Not having the ability
to

01:10:33.375 --> 01:10:36.834
number one, get a job,

01:10:36.834 --> 01:10:40.250
not have an ability
to redeem yourself,

01:10:40.834 --> 01:10:43.999
I think that\'s where
the recidivism rate goes

01:10:43.999 --> 01:10:45.917
through the roof because
you have people that

01:10:45.917 --> 01:10:47.583
are coming home
from jail that are

01:10:47.583 --> 01:10:48.959
looking for the opportunities

01:10:48.959 --> 01:10:50.625
And I know they\'re
looking for opportunity

01:10:50.625 --> 01:10:53.000
because my office is located on
Martin Luther King Boulevard.

01:10:53.000 --> 01:10:55.250
A lot of them come to my office.

01:10:55.250 --> 01:10:55.792
I hear so many times

01:10:55.834 --> 01:10:57.500
, guys
tell me, Tracey, I just

01:10:57.500 --> 01:10:58.999
need the opportunity.

01:10:58.999 --> 01:11:00.083
Tracey, I just need a job.

01:11:00.083 --> 01:11:02.875
Tracey, I don\'t want to go
back to what I used to do.

01:11:02.875 --> 01:11:04.291
Tracy, if you just
give me a chance,

01:11:04.291 --> 01:11:08.417
I\'ll prove to you that
I got value in me.

01:11:11.166 --> 01:11:12.000
And that hurts.

01:11:12.000 --> 01:11:12.750
When you look at a lot of

01:11:12.750 --> 01:11:19.083
these guys, I know for a fact

01:11:19.083 --> 01:11:21.999
that a lot of guys
are good people.

01:11:21.999 --> 01:11:24.834
Everybody that goes to
prison is not a bad person.

01:11:24.834 --> 01:11:28.000
So when you look at
folks that I know

01:11:28.000 --> 01:11:31.250
that want to change their
life, that are just looking

01:11:31.250 --> 01:11:36.333
for an opportunity to change
their life but never get it,

01:11:36.959 --> 01:11:39.166
it\'s hard not to
go back to where

01:11:39.166 --> 01:11:41.834
you know you can make a dollar.

01:11:41.834 --> 01:11:43.750
And I\'ve seen it
happen so many times.

01:11:43.750 --> 01:11:46.999
I\'ve seen guys that
say, Tracey, I tried.

01:11:46.999 --> 01:11:48.999
I couldn\'t get a job.

01:11:48.999 --> 01:11:51.375
So here I am back
out on the streets.

01:11:51.417 --> 01:11:53.999
Here I am back to doing
what I\'ve always done.

01:11:53.999 --> 01:11:55.875
When you\'ve lived a
certain way for so long

01:11:55.875 --> 01:12:01.542
and came as far as he
did, he came a long way,

01:12:01.542 --> 01:12:05.000
that needs to be put out
there because a lot of people

01:12:05.000 --> 01:12:07.999
don\'t know how to break the
chains from the street thing.

01:12:07.999 --> 01:12:09.709
That thing get a hold of you.

01:12:09.709 --> 01:12:12.792
That thing will hold
you until you die.

01:12:12.792 --> 01:12:13.000
To be on that

01:12:13.000 --> 01:12:17.709
Boulevard, for me, is

01:12:17.709 --> 01:12:21.999
to be that beacon
of hope of no matter

01:12:21.999 --> 01:12:23.999
where you come from, no
matter what you\'ve done,

01:12:23.999 --> 01:12:24.999
you can come out of that.

01:12:24.999 --> 01:12:28.458
Because that same
Boulevard, I sold drugs on.

01:12:28.458 --> 01:12:29.959
Directly across the
street from where

01:12:29.959 --> 01:12:32.959
my office is used to sit a
bar called The Nightlife,

01:12:32.959 --> 01:12:35.625
that I\'ve sold drugs out of
that bar for a number of years,

01:12:35.625 --> 01:12:37.083
inside and out.

01:12:37.083 --> 01:12:39.458
So to have my business on
Martin Luther King Boulevard

01:12:39.458 --> 01:12:43.999
and to show people that yes, I
was that once drug dealer that

01:12:43.999 --> 01:12:46.959
ran up and down the street
and sold drugs and did

01:12:46.959 --> 01:12:48.166
all that stuff there.

01:12:48.166 --> 01:12:51.959
I\'m now a changed person
and I\'m now somebody

01:12:51.959 --> 01:12:54.875
that they can aspire to also.

01:12:59.083 --> 01:13:01.999
Executive clemency was a
bittersweet victory to be

01:13:01.999 --> 01:13:05.959
honest with you because it
didn\'t take me very long after

01:13:05.959 --> 01:13:09.999
I got out and the excitement and
the exhilaration wore off that

01:13:09.999 --> 01:13:15.291
I realized that I may be free
but so many of my friends

01:13:15.291 --> 01:13:16.999
and other people aren\'t.

01:13:16.999 --> 01:13:20.959
And as long as they\'re
not, then I\'m not really.

01:13:20.959 --> 01:13:24.083
So I started the
CAN-DO foundation,

01:13:24.083 --> 01:13:26.625
which is Clemency For All
Nonviolent Drug Offenders,

01:13:26.625 --> 01:13:29.917
to try to continue to help some
of the women I left behind.

01:13:29.917 --> 01:13:34.875
I did time with Danielle,
Barbara, Mary Richardson,

01:13:34.875 --> 01:13:37.291
they\'ve all done
well over 20 years.

01:13:37.291 --> 01:13:39.667
These are all guys
who are serving life.

01:13:39.667 --> 01:13:40.999
These are for pot.

01:13:40.999 --> 01:13:43.999
He\'s for LSD.

01:13:43.999 --> 01:13:46.500
I just got back
from Washington DC.

01:13:46.500 --> 01:13:50.250
I was there for a fundraiser
about the whole clemency

01:13:50.250 --> 01:13:51.999
project that\'s happening.

01:13:51.999 --> 01:13:57.250
And in fact, I took
all these guys, too,

01:13:57.250 --> 01:13:58.917
in front of the White House.

01:13:58.917 --> 01:14:02.291
And anyway, there\'s
several of them

01:14:02.291 --> 01:14:05.000
that I stood out in
front of the White House

01:14:05.000 --> 01:14:08.999
advocating for their clemency.

01:14:08.999 --> 01:14:13.542
When I started practicing
law almost 40 years ago,

01:14:13.542 --> 01:14:15.125
there were about a
half a million people

01:14:15.125 --> 01:14:21.291
in prison and today there are
2.3 million people in person.

01:14:21.291 --> 01:14:23.458
The rate of
incarceration, the number

01:14:23.458 --> 01:14:27.999
of people in prison per 100,000
has gone up from about 130,

01:14:27.999 --> 01:14:31.375
140 to over 700 per 100,000.

01:14:31.375 --> 01:14:34.959
There\'s an enormous
increase in the number

01:14:34.959 --> 01:14:37.875
of people we are locking
up in our society

01:14:37.875 --> 01:14:40.417
in the course of my
professional career.

01:14:40.417 --> 01:14:40.999
Billions of dollars ha

01:14:40.999 --> 01:14:44.709
ve
been poured into the prison

01:14:44.709 --> 01:14:48.291
expansion, not only of the
federal prison capacity

01:14:48.291 --> 01:14:51.500
but billions have been sent
to state and local governments

01:14:51.500 --> 01:14:53.999
to expand their prison capacity.

01:14:53.999 --> 01:14:58.125
And during the 1990s,
we were building,

01:14:58.125 --> 01:15:00.333
on average, a prison a week.

01:15:00.333 --> 01:15:02.000
And as soon as these
prisons were built,

01:15:02.000 --> 01:15:04.667
it\'s important to emphasize,
they were immediately

01:15:04.667 --> 01:15:06.083
filled up with prisoners.

01:15:06.083 --> 01:15:09.458
And even today, many of
our prison facilities

01:15:09.458 --> 01:15:11.917
are operating beyond
their design capacity.

01:15:11.917 --> 01:15:12.667
If you compare the US with other
industri

01:15:12.667 --> 01:15:16.917
alized nations, Canada,

01:15:16.917 --> 01:15:19.208
Western Europe, we
lock up our citizens

01:15:19.208 --> 01:15:23.166
at five to ten times the
rate of those other nations.

01:15:23.166 --> 01:15:27.166
It\'s not that we have five or
ten times the rate of crime

01:15:27.166 --> 01:15:30.458
of those other nations
but we have consciously

01:15:30.458 --> 01:15:35.792
chosen to have a much more
punitive approach to crime

01:15:35.792 --> 01:15:38.291
than other comparable
nations have

01:15:38.291 --> 01:15:41.583
and that\'s the result that
we see in mass incarceration.

01:15:41.583 --> 01:15:41.875
Americ

01:15:41.875 --> 01:15:43.709
a\'s supposed to
be the land of the free

01:15:43.709 --> 01:15:48.709
and when you discover how many
people that are being locked up

01:15:48.709 --> 01:15:52.875
in our prisons it should make
people sit up and take notice.

01:15:52.875 --> 01:15:53.083
I often get as

01:15:53.083 --> 01:15:55.542
ked,
how do you feel

01:15:55.542 --> 01:16:00.417
now, having written federal
laws that are probably

01:16:00.417 --> 01:16:04.834
the most unjust federal laws
that have ever been written?

01:16:07.333 --> 01:16:10.041
15,000 people go to
prison every year

01:16:10.041 --> 01:16:12.999
getting these
mandatory sentences.

01:16:12.999 --> 01:16:13.999
So this is 20 years.

01:16:13.999 --> 01:16:18.750
This is 300,000
people who have gotten

01:16:18.750 --> 01:16:22.417
these mandatory sentences
I played a role in writing.

01:16:23.750 --> 01:16:25.792
It\'s horrifying.

01:16:25.834 --> 01:16:28.166
If I\'d been a better
attorney, maybe I

01:16:28.166 --> 01:16:31.291
could have... if I
had been craftier,

01:16:31.291 --> 01:16:37.583
maybe if I had taken... they
might not have been as bad.

01:16:37.959 --> 01:16:40.625
I\'m grateful that I\'ve
had the opportunity now,

01:16:40.625 --> 01:16:43.500
since 1989, to try
to end these laws.

01:16:43.500 --> 01:16:47.208
Fortunately, many
former prisoners,

01:16:47.208 --> 01:16:50.583
many prisoners who write to
me are grateful for the work

01:16:50.583 --> 01:16:51.166
that I\'m doing.

01:16:51.166 --> 01:16:53.625
And I take a great
deal of solace

01:16:53.625 --> 01:16:56.709
that I\'m in a position
where I can, sort of, help

01:16:56.709 --> 01:16:58.834
try to end these mandatories.

01:17:01.917 --> 01:17:08.083
What keeps me going
are the children.

01:17:08.333 --> 01:17:15.999
And the love that the parent
has for their child and the love

01:17:15.999 --> 01:17:18.333
that the child has
for their parent.

01:17:18.333 --> 01:17:18.750
The children\'s

01:17:18.792 --> 01:17:22.208
love is
pretty unconditional,

01:17:22.208 --> 01:17:22.750
pretty unconditional a

01:17:22.792 --> 01:17:27.750
nd
they don\'t stop loving you

01:17:27.750 --> 01:17:31.834
just because you\'re behind bars.

01:17:31.917 --> 01:17:35.792
My name\'s Brett Gelico 126-3706.

01:17:35.792 --> 01:17:37.667
My first encounter
with the prison system

01:17:37.667 --> 01:17:39.709
started pretty young.

01:17:39.709 --> 01:17:42.291
Lifestyle with
drugs started early.

01:17:42.291 --> 01:17:44.709
The thing with me was,
I got out in February,

01:17:44.709 --> 01:17:46.583
I think it was 2012.

01:17:46.583 --> 01:17:49.083
Within three months, I got
out, paid my court fines,

01:17:49.083 --> 01:17:53.999
paid my restitution, paid
child support, paid everything.

01:17:53.999 --> 01:17:55.999
I was at zero.

01:17:55.999 --> 01:17:57.999
I started my own business.

01:17:57.999 --> 01:17:59.083
I got a vehicle.

01:17:59.083 --> 01:17:59.875
It had tags.

01:17:59.875 --> 01:18:01.375
It had a license and everything.

01:18:01.375 --> 01:18:02.083
In October that year, I
decided to s

01:18:02.083 --> 01:18:04.125
moke some weed.

01:18:04.125 --> 01:18:05.999
And I thought the
worst case scenario

01:18:05.999 --> 01:18:08.041
if I go to the probation
office that I\'d

01:18:08.041 --> 01:18:09.667
have to go to a
program where I had

01:18:09.667 --> 01:18:10.999
to be urine tested regularly.

01:18:10.999 --> 01:18:12.375
I\'d go to NA and AA meeting.

01:18:12.375 --> 01:18:14.166
Well, the reality of the
fact is, a dirty urine

01:18:14.166 --> 01:18:15.959
is a violation.

01:18:15.959 --> 01:18:18.291
And the probation
officer I had was new

01:18:18.291 --> 01:18:20.083
and she was a
stickler for the law

01:18:20.083 --> 01:18:22.500
and she violated me
there on the spot.

01:18:22.500 --> 01:18:24.083
I wept like a little child.

01:18:24.083 --> 01:18:26.500
I couldn\'t believe I
made all this work.

01:18:26.500 --> 01:18:29.709
I\'m like, I have all
this to show you.

01:18:29.709 --> 01:18:31.959
Look at all this.

01:18:31.959 --> 01:18:33.125
I\'ve done it.

01:18:33.125 --> 01:18:36.250
She\'s like, you\'ve done a lot,
but you\'re still using drugs

01:18:36.250 --> 01:18:37.999
and it\'s against the law.

01:18:38.000 --> 01:18:42.625
I got sentenced to four
years for a dirty urinalysis.

01:18:42.917 --> 01:18:45.999
It\'s a lot watching your
children grow up and miss you

01:18:45.999 --> 01:18:50.166
and wave and say bye, Daddy, as
they\'re walking out of a visit.

01:18:50.166 --> 01:18:51.709
It doesn\'t get easy.

01:18:51.709 --> 01:18:52.417
You know what I\'m saying?

01:18:52.417 --> 01:18:54.250
And as you get older,
you think you\'d

01:18:54.250 --> 01:18:56.709
become more accustomed
to this but it never,

01:18:56.709 --> 01:18:59.834
under any circumstances,
gets easier.

01:19:03.667 --> 01:19:04.750
Hey, guys.

01:19:04.750 --> 01:19:06.792
How are you doing?

01:19:06.792 --> 01:19:11.709
First off, Zen, I
want to say thank you

01:19:11.709 --> 01:19:15.333
for spending as much time as
you do at the house watching

01:19:15.333 --> 01:19:17.041
everybody while Mom\'s at work.

01:19:17.041 --> 01:19:20.041
I know you miss out on playtime.

01:19:20.041 --> 01:19:22.458
I know you miss out
on a lot of things.

01:19:22.458 --> 01:19:25.417
So I just wanted to start
off by saying thank you.

01:19:25.417 --> 01:19:29.333
I\'m proud of you for wrestling.

01:19:29.333 --> 01:19:30.999
I\'m glad you\'re
sticking with it.

01:19:30.999 --> 01:19:32.542
I know you\'re getting
sore but just like I

01:19:32.542 --> 01:19:35.291
said, try to stick with it.

01:19:35.291 --> 01:19:36.959
You\'re the man of the house.

01:19:36.959 --> 01:19:37.999
Do the best you can.

01:19:37.999 --> 01:19:39.291
Take out the trash.

01:19:39.291 --> 01:19:40.999
Try and stick to your manners.

01:19:40.999 --> 01:19:44.041
I love you and I\'m
so very proud of you.

01:19:44.041 --> 01:19:45.959
And your haircut
looks wonderful.

01:19:45.959 --> 01:19:47.291
I\'m glad.

01:19:47.291 --> 01:19:49.208
You\'re growing up so fast.

01:19:49.208 --> 01:19:52.834
From seven to 13,
you\'ve really grown up

01:19:52.834 --> 01:19:54.999
and I\'m sorry I\'m not
there to guide you

01:19:54.999 --> 01:20:00.208
as much as I\'d like but
you\'re turning out pretty good

01:20:00.208 --> 01:20:02.917
and I\'m very, very proud of you.

01:20:02.917 --> 01:20:05.041
I really am.

01:20:05.041 --> 01:20:08.792
Now, on a lighter
not, Ceryn, my baby,

01:20:09.250 --> 01:20:10.999
I love you and I
miss you very much.

01:20:10.999 --> 01:20:13.500
Recently you just
got honor roll.

01:20:13.500 --> 01:20:15.041
I\'m so very proud of you.

01:20:15.041 --> 01:20:16.417
I know you worked hard.

01:20:16.417 --> 01:20:18.083
Mom was telling me
how you were doing

01:20:18.083 --> 01:20:22.875
and you\'re just
growing up so fast.

01:20:23.875 --> 01:20:25.999
And Knucklehead, my
little Knucklehead,

01:20:25.999 --> 01:20:28.999
Brody, I want you to
know that I love you

01:20:28.999 --> 01:20:30.875
and I miss you very much.

01:20:30.875 --> 01:20:32.999
I have a book here that
says When I Miss You.

01:20:32.999 --> 01:20:34.999
There\'s a bunch of books
that I went through

01:20:34.999 --> 01:20:36.417
and this is the
one that I thought

01:20:36.417 --> 01:20:37.709
would be more appropriate.

01:20:37.709 --> 01:20:41.875
So anytime you think of
me, you\'re missing me,

01:20:41.875 --> 01:20:44.041
there\'s a guinea pig who\'s
going through the same things

01:20:44.041 --> 01:20:46.417
with his mom when
she goes to work.

01:20:46.417 --> 01:20:51.166
I love you and I miss you all
and I hope to see you soon.

01:20:51.166 --> 01:20:52.417
Daddy loves you.

01:20:52.999 --> 01:20:54.917
Bye.

01:20:56.999 --> 01:20:58.875
I think that\'s good.

01:20:58.999 --> 01:21:01.875
That was a little
harder than I thought.

01:21:01.999 --> 01:21:03.375
Good job.

01:21:03.375 --> 01:21:05.625
Because of the fact
that so many of us

01:21:05.625 --> 01:21:10.250
have lived for 30 years in
this box of mandatory sentences

01:21:10.250 --> 01:21:14.166
and federal sentencing
guidelines and the drug war,

01:21:14.166 --> 01:21:16.709
we have to start
breaking out of that box

01:21:16.709 --> 01:21:20.959
and thinking about a world
outside of those confines.

01:21:20.959 --> 01:21:23.999
If you\'re interested in
reducing the injustice

01:21:23.999 --> 01:21:26.041
and reducing mass
incarceration, you

01:21:26.041 --> 01:21:27.999
have to go to the root
of the problem, which

01:21:27.999 --> 01:21:29.959
is too many laws on the books.

01:21:29.959 --> 01:21:33.542
And what is the primary problem
there as far as prioritizing

01:21:33.542 --> 01:21:35.834
which laws ought to go first?

01:21:35.834 --> 01:21:37.875
The top of my list
is the drug laws

01:21:37.875 --> 01:21:42.000
because I think we\'re in
another situation where it\'s

01:21:42.000 --> 01:21:44.375
very similar to the days
of alcohol prohibition

01:21:44.375 --> 01:21:47.375
where the government has
just declared millions

01:21:47.375 --> 01:21:49.041
and millions of
people to be criminals

01:21:49.041 --> 01:21:51.291
and that\'s what they\'ve
done with these drug laws.

01:21:51.291 --> 01:21:53.917
So we have to move
away from the drug war

01:21:53.917 --> 01:21:56.999
the same way in which we moved
away from alcohol prohibition.

01:21:56.999 --> 01:21:59.208
There will be some
problems when that\'s done

01:21:59.208 --> 01:22:03.208
but that\'s far and away
the primary problem that

01:22:03.208 --> 01:22:04.125
needs to be addressed.

01:22:04.125 --> 01:22:09.542
The danger of looking at one
outrageous case after another

01:22:09.542 --> 01:22:14.333
can blind you to the
broader perspective

01:22:14.333 --> 01:22:16.750
that there are so
many of these cases,

01:22:16.750 --> 01:22:19.792
that these are actually
the typical pattern.

01:22:19.792 --> 01:22:22.750
This is the system.

01:22:22.750 --> 01:22:26.208
It is broadly unjust.

01:22:26.959 --> 01:22:30.709
And that it is so wasteful.

01:22:30.709 --> 01:22:33.000
It\'s so counterproductive.

01:22:33.000 --> 01:22:35.250
It\'s so inefficient.

01:22:35.250 --> 01:22:37.250
One has to be outraged.

01:22:37.250 --> 01:22:39.625
Why does it continue?

01:22:39.625 --> 01:22:40.208
Why are we unable to stop
prom

01:22:40.250 --> 01:22:44.208
ptly, more efficiently,

01:22:44.208 --> 01:22:48.375
a policy that\'s been
going on since 1986

01:22:48.375 --> 01:22:51.166
of locking up so many
low-level offenders

01:22:51.166 --> 01:22:55.166
and treating them
as major kingpins?

01:22:55.166 --> 01:22:58.458
That\'s a very deeply
disturbing indictment

01:22:58.458 --> 01:23:01.500
that we\'re willing to
waste so much treasure

01:23:01.500 --> 01:23:07.250
and inflict so much harm
and cause so much injustice

01:23:07.250 --> 01:23:11.417
in a society where our credos
are about liberty and justice

01:23:11.417 --> 01:23:13.291
for all.