WEBVTT

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[in Hebrew] How do we reach
the detention cells?

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With the elevator.

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Is it going down?

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[elevator dings]

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- [man] Lea, what will become of you?
- What do you think?

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When will you mend your ways?

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- [Lea] Who me? I\'m a lost
cause.-A rebel with a lost cause!

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-A rebel with a lost cause. -[Lea laughs]

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[elevator dings]

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[Lea muttering indistinctly]

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Hello, how are you?

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- [in Arabic] Today, we respond
to the charges. -Respond?

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Guilty or not guilty.

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What we did and what we didn\'t do.

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Okay, regarding the bus driver.

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They say that you waited
for the bus to accelerate

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before stabbing him, so he\'d cause a crash.

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-Not true? -No.

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I won\'t admit to that,
I\'ll deny that charge.

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- That\'s what I\'ll say? -I
will, I do the talking.

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I respond, not you.

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In your name, I\'m your advocate.

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Tell me, has your
mothervisited you in jail?

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-[man] No. -Why not?

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Did she contact the Red Cross (ICRC)?

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The only visitor I hadwas
my 13-year-old sister.

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Ah.

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[traffic passing by]

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POSSESSION OF A WEAPON STONE THROWING

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ACCESSORY TO MURDER SUICIDE BOMBINGS

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CASE LAW MINORS POSSESSION OF A KNIFE

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[Lea] Try to get into the head of a
Jewish Israeli judge in Tel Aviv.

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What does he think when
someone gets on a bus,

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stabs the driver while he\'s driving,

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and then stabs 11 passengers?

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And then gets off and keeps
stabbing them while they flee!

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-The fear is great. -Sure.

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They could sentence himto
many years in prison.

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More than in this plea bargain.

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I\'m the one who offered
the prosecution 28 years.

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Hopefully, we\'ll close on
these terms, not worse.

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What\'s this fly doing here?

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[slap]

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[all chuckle]

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[Lea] Oy, I didn\'t catch it.

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[woman] Do all such cases
get referred to you?

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- Anybody who does anything?
- [Lea] No, not anybody.

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But you liketo take the tough cases?

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I\'m not afraid to, it\'s not that I like to.

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I always see the person behind the case.

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- That\'s the important thing.
- [woman] Right.

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[Lea] I met with your mother,
I reached a plea bargain.

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A lot, and yet less...

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As such, it\'s a lot.

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But I was afraid they\'d give you even more.

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-Understand?-Life in prison?

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Not life, 28 years.

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Now, it\'s a lot but...

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I was afraid they\'d give you more.

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At first, they charged you
with 11 attempted murders.

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Now, they\'ve agreed to reduce
it to one attempted murder,

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just the bus driver.

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The rest are nowinjurious assaults, see?

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[humming]

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[female TV host in Hebrew] My next
guest is very controversial, no?

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So they say.

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Good morning, Lea Tsemel.

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You defend terrorists and their families.

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I imagined you differently,
taller and tougher.

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I left my devil\'s tail at home this time.

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-[host] You\'ve been called that, no? -Yeah.

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\"Devil\" and stuff like that.

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I\'ve been called every name in the book.

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Like what?

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\"Traitor, leftist, devil\'s advocate...\"

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Does it hurt you?

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No, it can alsobe a compliment!

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I always took itas a compliment.

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-Do you have kids? -Yes.

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How do they live with it?

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We had some tough times, but...

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The Israeli public gradually promoted me

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from \"devil\'s advocate\"to
\"human rights lawyer,\"

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over the years.

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Today, it\'s honorable to be my children.

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And your husband?

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He too is a leftist activist.

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Tell you what...

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I think that terrorists

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are no different than
rapists and murderers.

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You call them \"terrorists.\"

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The average person in the world
would call them \"freedom fighters.\"

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Even those who...

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Any Palestinian who resists the occupation.

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You\'re asking: \"Will you defend anyone?\"

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Any Palestinian who commits an act,

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be it \"conventional,\"
be it \"controversial.\"

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It makes no difference.

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Israelis have no right

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to tell the Palestinianshow to struggle.

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It\'s as if you identify with them!

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I can\'t understand you.
But that\'s okay, right?

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You should try to understand me because...

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I am the future.

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The political questions we\'re
facing in Israel today,

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we\'ll face for many years to come.

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So if you try, you\'ll see I have a point.

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Thank you, Lea.

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[Lea humming]

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♪ What a country ♪

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♪ What a country ♪

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[humming]

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Yasser!

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[humming continues]

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Suheila, not like this.

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-Suheila.-[Suheila] What?

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For God\'s sake.

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I want it sorted according to prisons.

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-[Suheila] You said alphabetically. -No.

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I said alphabetically?
This is alphabetical?

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-How is it alphabetical?-By last name.

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-[Lea] I asked for this?-Yes.

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So where\'s A? It starts with Z!

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This is page 2.

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Page 2 comes before page 1?

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-Yes. -Yes.

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A comes before B.

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Come on! And Q is certainly not...

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Here\'s A, B, C, D...

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- I want it sorted by prisons.
- [Suheila] Get someone else to do it.

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[in English] I have to go.

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- [phone rings] -[man in
Arabic] \"Lea Tsemel.\"

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Ossama is speaking.

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[Lea] Hassan and Ahmad, that\'s
the kid and his cousin?

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They\'re cousins. One is
dead, one is injured.

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Who\'s our kid, Hassan or Ahmad?

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[man] We\'re representing Ahmad.

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-And Hassan is dead? -[man] Hassan is dead.

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\"Eliminated.\"

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- [Ossama] You wanted to see the
news clip, no? -[TV: theme music]

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Yes.

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-This is it? -Yes.

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[male newscaster in Hebrew]The wave of
terror goes on: three attacks in Jerusalem

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left four people severely injured.

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Pay attention to their ages.

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One of the victims is only 13,

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none of the stabbers is also 13!

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[screaming, clamoring]

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[man] It\'s two kids!

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[female newscaster] The Pisgat Zeev
neighborhood in Jerusalem, 3:00 p.m.

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Two terroristsarmed with
knivesgo on a stabbing spree.

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-[Lea] That\'s them? -[Ossama] Yes!

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[newscaster] They stab a man,
causing him serious wounds.

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They keep going and spot a boy on his bike

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and wound him critically.

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- [Lea] Who\'s that? -[Ossama]
The kid on the bike.

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[newscaster] When a civilian
spots them, they flee.

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One terrorist is hit by a car,

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the other is eliminatedby the police.

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-[Lea] That\'s Hassan? -[Ossama] Yes.

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[Lea] Oh, my God!

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[newscaster] The terrorists, 13 and 17,

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are from Arab Beit Hanina,
next to Jewish Pisgat Zeev.

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Two neighborhoods in constant conflict.

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[Ossama] Now pay attention to this.

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This is our kid, Ahmad.

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[man] Die, you maniac!

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-[Ahmad gasping]-[man] Die, you maniac!

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-Die, you son of a bitch! -[woman wails]

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[man]Die, you son of a bitch!

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Die, you motherfucker!

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Die, son of a bitch. Die!

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-Motherfucker! -[officer] Move away.

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-[man] Murder him! -[officer] Move away!

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[man] Put a bullet in his head.

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Come on, a bullet in the head!

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They shot the other one.

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[scoffs]

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[clamoring fades]

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[Ossama] Their fathers are coming now.

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- [in Arabic] You\'re the father of...
- [man] Hassan.

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You\'re Hassan\'s father?

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-You\'re Ahmad\'s father? -Yes.

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How old was Hassan?

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- [Hassan\'s father]Hassan
was 15 years old.-Fifteen?

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- [Hassan\'s father] He just turned 15.
- Let me note this.

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Wow, I didn\'t realize...
I thought he was older!

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When they said the little one was only 13,

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everyone assumedthe bigger one was older.

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Did the police tell you that he was dead?

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During my interrogation,

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they told me to goout to the yard.

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There was an ambulance there.

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They took out a corpse,
unzipped the nylon bag,

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and I saw my son Hassan.

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- You saw it was him. -I
saw my son was dead.

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You identified his body.

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Okay.

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And you didn\'t undergo any interrogations?

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[Ahmad\'s father] No, I haven\'t
seen my son to this day.

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- They just asked me aboutthe
knife.-[Lea] Just that specific knife?

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Describe it.

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[Ahmad\'s father]Like a Rambo
knife, with a serrated blade.

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You use it to slaughter sheep?

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[Ahmad\'s father] No, it\'s a decoration.

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- Ah. Just for display?
- [Ahmad\'s father] Yes.

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I kept it in a safe place,
even though it\'s not sharp.

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- Not sharp? -[Ahmad\'s father]
Right, it isn\'t sharp.

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You looked but didn\'t find it?

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[Ahmad\'s father]It wasn\'t there.

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Okay... Detention of a minor.

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Let\'s hope there\'s no press!

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[clamoring]

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[man in Hebrew] Go ahead, Lea.

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Where\'s the kid?

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[man] Here he comes!

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He\'s coming, he\'s coming!

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-[shutters clicking] -Where is he?

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[reporter]Did you catch his smile?

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[Lea]He\'s crying, not smiling.

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-[reporter] Cute smile. -[Lea] He\'s crying!

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-[man] Got him? -[man 2] Got him good.

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[reporter] Cutie.

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I got him smiling! You name it, I got it.

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[reporter 2] Strong like a bull.

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[man] Wow.

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[shutters clicking]

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[reporter] Lea, Lea, Lea!

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Come! It\'s the kid\'s father.

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[in Arabic]When he saw me, he said:

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- \"You don\'t love me.\" -What?

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\"You don\'t love me.\"I asked: \"Why?\"

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He said: \"You\'re a Jew, and
the Jews don\'t love me.\"

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I said: \"Try me.\"

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He\'s the youngest kidin detention.

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He seems like a nice boy.

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Here\'s Atty. Tareq Barghout.

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He represents the Palestinian
Prisoners Office, in Ramallah.

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We need to consult.

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I talked with the kid.

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-He\'s cute. -Very cute.

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And he says he didn\'t stab.

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They talked about stabbing a man.

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But not children or
women, nothing like that.

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Question is... I was just
reading the Youth Law.

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\"Detention of a minor before indictment...

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Article 17 stipulates that...\"

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Come on!

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\"The detention of a minor
after indictment...

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The article doesn\'t apply
to minors under age 14.\"

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[Lea in Hebrew] The kidcomplained
about the wayhe\'s being interrogated,

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and the treatmenthe\'s receiving,

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includingin the courthouse cells.

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He\'s being beaten,
threatened and humiliated.

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- [man] Why did he have a knife?
- [Tareq] What?

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[man]If he didn\'t intend to
stab, why did he have a knife?

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We\'re not sayinghe didn\'t intend to stab,

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we\'re saying he didn\'tpartake
in the stabbing.

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Don\'t forget he\'s a 13-year-old boy

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who still can\'t tell right from wrong,

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which is why the law stipulates

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that minors under 14 cannot be imprisoned.

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-[man] Your name?-Tareq Barghout.

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-[man] And? -Lea Tsemel, Advocate.

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-[Tareq] Thank you! -[Lea] Thank you.

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Good job, guys!

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[male newscaster] The kidentered the remand
hearingnwith a faint smile on his face.

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The Jerusalem Magistrate\'s
Court extended his detention.

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His lawyers are claiminghe didn\'t stab.

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\"Maybe he intended to stab,
but he\'s not a \'terrorist\'.\"

00:17:02.625 --> 00:17:05.457
Someone wrote:\"The media blurred his face.

00:17:05.458 --> 00:17:10.249
Way to protect the human rightsof
somebody devoid of humanity.\"

00:17:10.250 --> 00:17:13.833
- [phone rings] -[man on
phone] Lea, how are you?

00:17:13.834 --> 00:17:14.999
Fine.

00:17:15.000 --> 00:17:16.666
Josh Breiner from Walla News.

00:17:16.667 --> 00:17:17.791
-Hi. -Hi.

00:17:17.792 --> 00:17:20.582
How did it go in court today, with the kid?

00:17:20.583 --> 00:17:22.916
[sighs] I don\'t know,

00:17:22.917 --> 00:17:25.207
it\'s the first time I\'ve seen him.

00:17:25.208 --> 00:17:28.082
Have you ever had a case like this?

00:17:28.083 --> 00:17:30.792
Thirteen? No.

00:17:31.834 --> 00:17:34.250
Never.

00:17:45.750 --> 00:17:49.332
In June 1967, I was a law student.

00:17:49.333 --> 00:17:54.207
Suddenly, one morning,
shells started exploding.

00:17:54.208 --> 00:17:57.791
Scary, super scary.

00:17:57.792 --> 00:18:02.666
They asked who amongthe
students wants to volunteer.

00:18:02.667 --> 00:18:05.500
And I volunteered.

00:18:07.250 --> 00:18:10.416
I remember the war was still raging,

00:18:10.417 --> 00:18:13.124
but the Old City had been conquered.

00:18:13.125 --> 00:18:17.999
So I snuck into the Old City
with another volunteer,

00:18:18.000 --> 00:18:20.249
and went to the Wailing Wall.

00:18:20.250 --> 00:18:25.332
Kids in the street yelled:
\"Moshe Dayan, Moshe Dayan!\"

00:18:25.333 --> 00:18:28.666
It was a tiny, narrow alley.

00:18:28.667 --> 00:18:31.290
We took pictures with the soldiers.

00:18:31.291 --> 00:18:38.291
Later, I heard I was the first
Israeli woman at the Wailing Wall.

00:18:38.375 --> 00:18:46.375
It was a very special moment.

00:18:46.458 --> 00:18:48.999
But all this wonder and euphoria

00:18:49.000 --> 00:18:54.833
had to do with the feeling that now
there could be some \"togetherness.\"

00:18:54.834 --> 00:18:58.208
It was a \"War for Peace.\"

00:18:58.500 --> 00:19:04.458
In my naiïveté, I totally believed it.

00:19:06.208 --> 00:19:09.417
It didn\'t last long.

00:19:15.875 --> 00:19:18.165
As soon as the war ended,

00:19:18.166 --> 00:19:23.083
they took the volunteers to
tour the Occupied Territories.

00:19:23.458 --> 00:19:24.749
On the road from Jerusalem,

00:19:24.750 --> 00:19:29.124
I saw people heading downtoward Jericho.

00:19:29.125 --> 00:19:34.959
Lines of peoplegoing into exile.

00:19:35.583 --> 00:19:41.416
It reminded me of a picture
I grew up with at home.

00:19:41.417 --> 00:19:45.708
It was called: \"The Wandering Jew.\"

00:19:47.375 --> 00:19:51.124
My mother immigrated from Europe in 1933.

00:19:51.125 --> 00:19:53.666
She later managed to bring her parents,

00:19:53.667 --> 00:20:00.165
just before the Holocaust.

00:20:00.166 --> 00:20:06.750
The rest of the family was annihilated.

00:20:06.834 --> 00:20:11.750
It\'s part of our family load.

00:20:17.917 --> 00:20:20.332
I\'m from Haifa, a mixed Arab-Jewish city.

00:20:20.333 --> 00:20:25.207
I grew up in an Arab-owned
house, I was born in 1945.

00:20:25.208 --> 00:20:29.833
In 1948, they fled and
weren\'t allowed to return.

00:20:29.834 --> 00:20:32.207
1948, how could we have done that?

00:20:32.208 --> 00:20:37.708
What happened to those refugees?
And now there are new refugees!

00:20:39.041 --> 00:20:41.874
When I went to the Wailing Wall,

00:20:41.875 --> 00:20:45.707
it was just a narrow alley
with a handful of soldiers.

00:20:45.708 --> 00:20:51.290
Soon after, they demolished the
houses around the Wailing Wall.

00:20:51.291 --> 00:20:54.833
When I went back, the
neighborhood was gone!

00:20:54.834 --> 00:20:59.207
I asked: \"What about the
people who lived here?\"

00:20:59.208 --> 00:21:05.208
The kids who yelled: \"Moshe
Dayan\" were from there!

00:21:05.667 --> 00:21:07.917
I needed answers.

00:21:08.875 --> 00:21:10.791
In the university in those days,

00:21:10.792 --> 00:21:16.165
there was a group of \"weirdos\"
who hung out on campus

00:21:16.166 --> 00:21:17.332
and had things to say.

00:21:17.333 --> 00:21:21.624
\"Guys, they fooled us, it\'s all a bluff!

00:21:21.625 --> 00:21:27.416
It\'s not land without people
for a people without a land.\"

00:21:27.417 --> 00:21:29.374
\"There were people here!\"
I was very ambivalent.

00:21:29.375 --> 00:21:33.958
I said: \"Matzpen and its
politics aren\'t for me.

00:21:33.959 --> 00:21:36.874
I come from a Zionist home,
like everyone else!\"

00:21:36.875 --> 00:21:41.624
But I was drawn to thembecause
they had answersto my questions.

00:21:41.625 --> 00:21:47.541
And I made my choice, I joined Matzpen.

00:21:47.542 --> 00:21:53.959
From that moment on, I never looked back.

00:21:55.792 --> 00:21:59.083
[man]We met at the Hebrew University.

00:21:59.500 --> 00:22:05.332
I was still a religious
boy in religious attire.

00:22:05.333 --> 00:22:08.583
One day, I saw some commotion.

00:22:09.708 --> 00:22:14.083
A brawl on the Hebrew University lawn.

00:22:14.667 --> 00:22:18.416
People were tearing up a flyer

00:22:18.417 --> 00:22:23.666
that was being distributed
by a group called \"Matzpen.\"

00:22:23.667 --> 00:22:26.207
Where\'s your national pride?

00:22:26.208 --> 00:22:29.207
Look me in the eyes, fellow Jews!

00:22:29.208 --> 00:22:31.916
Look me in the eyes, girl!

00:22:31.917 --> 00:22:34.791
You who will soon bethe mother of children!

00:22:34.792 --> 00:22:37.958
[man] But in the middle of this mess,

00:22:37.959 --> 00:22:42.125
I spot a short little woman.

00:22:42.250 --> 00:22:43.959
Beautiful.

00:22:44.625 --> 00:22:47.833
Fashionably dressedin an extra short skirt,

00:22:47.834 --> 00:22:50.916
with extra high boots.

00:22:50.917 --> 00:22:56.541
Waving around a metal
chain with tons of keys,

00:22:56.542 --> 00:22:59.082
like a prison warden.

00:22:59.083 --> 00:23:02.040
To this day, she has tons of keys.

00:23:02.041 --> 00:23:03.833
God knows what they open.

00:23:03.834 --> 00:23:09.249
And using expressions I\'d never even heard,

00:23:09.250 --> 00:23:11.999
let alone said.

00:23:12.000 --> 00:23:13.582
Curses...

00:23:13.583 --> 00:23:19.291
\"Ah, you want to fuck me,
with that little dick?\"

00:23:20.333 --> 00:23:24.666
I stood there speechless.

00:23:24.667 --> 00:23:27.541
So I asked someone: \"Who\'s that?\"

00:23:27.542 --> 00:23:30.249
\"Don\'t you know? Lea Tsemel!\"

00:23:30.250 --> 00:23:35.040
I joined Matzpen soon after.

00:23:35.041 --> 00:23:36.165
Maybe for her legs...

00:23:36.166 --> 00:23:41.582
I don\'t know if it was for
the ideology, or her legs.

00:23:41.583 --> 00:23:43.417
But I joined.

00:23:43.583 --> 00:23:48.041
A year and a half later, we were a couple.

00:23:52.375 --> 00:23:54.708
[Lea mutters]

00:23:56.083 --> 00:24:00.417
\"Conspiracy to commit a crime...\"

00:24:02.166 --> 00:24:04.291
This one and this one.

00:24:06.125 --> 00:24:11.166
PRECEDENTS, ATTEMPTED MURDER

00:24:14.667 --> 00:24:16.207
[grunts]

00:24:16.208 --> 00:24:18.040
Here, three monthsof community service

00:24:18.041 --> 00:24:21.833
for a Jewish man who attacked
an Arab woman and her children.

00:24:21.834 --> 00:24:26.999
We don\'t want attacks, we
want stabbings and knives...

00:24:27.000 --> 00:24:29.416
-Look for knives!-[Lea] So what?

00:24:29.417 --> 00:24:33.999
He beat her with a plank of wood!
Who cares if it\'s a knife?

00:24:34.000 --> 00:24:37.791
- A shooting, isn\'t it better?
- [Tareq] Sure, it\'s better.

00:24:37.792 --> 00:24:41.500
[Lea] Voilà! We have shootings.

00:24:42.875 --> 00:24:44.624
Now let\'s look at the...

00:24:44.625 --> 00:24:50.749
- Official video of the...
- [Lea] Government Press Office.

00:24:50.750 --> 00:24:54.124
[Benjamin Netanyahu on
video] First, he isn\'t dead.

00:24:54.125 --> 00:24:56.249
He\'s alive!

00:24:56.250 --> 00:24:59.208
Second, he isn\'t naive.

00:24:59.792 --> 00:25:02.416
Third, he isn\'t innocent.

00:25:02.417 --> 00:25:06.582
He tried to murder a 13-year-old boy.

00:25:06.583 --> 00:25:11.582
[Tareq]He pronounced him guiltybefore
he was even interrogated.

00:25:11.583 --> 00:25:12.666
[Netanyahu] This lie,

00:25:12.667 --> 00:25:17.416
which together with allnthe
other lies forms one big...

00:25:17.417 --> 00:25:19.708
[Tareq] One big lie.

00:25:19.959 --> 00:25:21.791
Is to tell the truth.

00:25:21.792 --> 00:25:25.499
We reject the false symmetry

00:25:25.500 --> 00:25:27.499
between Israelis under attack

00:25:27.500 --> 00:25:31.874
- and the terrorists who attack them.
- [Lea groans]

00:25:31.875 --> 00:25:33.624
[Tareq]Even the internetdoesn\'t
want to hear him.

00:25:33.625 --> 00:25:39.165
[in English] ...is the result of
continuous Palestinian incitement...

00:25:39.166 --> 00:25:40.958
[Tareq scoffs]

00:25:40.959 --> 00:25:44.082
Yesterday, President Mahmoud Abbas,

00:25:44.083 --> 00:25:48.332
accused Israel of putting to death,

00:25:48.333 --> 00:25:52.541
executing, an innocent Palestinian boy.

00:25:52.542 --> 00:25:55.207
First of all, he\'s not dead, he\'s alive.

00:25:55.208 --> 00:25:59.040
Second, he\'s not innocent.
He tried to kill! Murder!

00:25:59.041 --> 00:26:02.040
- Thank you very much.-[Abbas in
Arabic]Our homes, and our lands,

00:26:02.041 --> 00:26:05.207
and our children, killed in cold blood.

00:26:05.208 --> 00:26:08.916
Like they did to this child, Ahmad ♪*♪*♪*♪*

00:26:08.917 --> 00:26:15.582
and other kids in Jerusalemand
the Palestinian territories.

00:26:15.583 --> 00:26:21.040
Abu Mazen said that as far
as he knows, the kid died.

00:26:21.041 --> 00:26:24.582
He\'s right, a kid died! A 15-year-old.

00:26:24.583 --> 00:26:28.749
[Tareq]Yeah, he waved a
pictureof the wrong kid.

00:26:28.750 --> 00:26:32.582
He wasn\'t mistaken about the result.
He got the name wrong.

00:26:32.583 --> 00:26:37.916
[Tareq]He got the name wrong,
but the other one lied.

00:26:37.917 --> 00:26:39.624
That\'s the occupation.

00:26:39.625 --> 00:26:43.082
[Lea] And when a Jew comes along
and does something similar...

00:26:43.083 --> 00:26:47.541
[Tareq]But that\'s what happened!
In Pisgat Zeev,

00:26:47.542 --> 00:26:48.500
the same neighborhood,

00:26:48.501 --> 00:26:52.541
there was a \"lynch\" against Arabs.

00:26:52.542 --> 00:26:57.457
Two Arab minors were
attacked by dozens of Jews.

00:26:57.458 --> 00:27:00.624
Those attackers weren\'t charged
with attempted murder.

00:27:00.625 --> 00:27:03.082
[Tareq]But factually speakingit\'s similar!

00:27:03.083 --> 00:27:05.916
But they were charged
with injurious assault!

00:27:05.917 --> 00:27:09.791
That\'s how the authorities seta
discriminatory double standard

00:27:09.792 --> 00:27:15.749
without openly saying: \"These
charges apply to Arabs only.\"

00:27:15.750 --> 00:27:20.332
Did you get confirmationthat
the knife was clean?

00:27:20.333 --> 00:27:21.707
-Yes.-It\'s confirmed?

00:27:21.708 --> 00:27:25.749
Yes, there were no DNA findings.

00:27:25.750 --> 00:27:30.582
- Meaning there wasn\'t...
- [Lea] No blood on his knife.

00:27:30.583 --> 00:27:32.750
His knife was clean.

00:28:09.542 --> 00:28:14.124
- Can I enter?-It\'s forbidden.
The judge won\'t allow it.

00:28:14.125 --> 00:28:17.124
-Before the judge enters... -No way.

00:28:17.125 --> 00:28:21.208
I don\'t mess aroundwith judges.

00:28:22.708 --> 00:28:26.834
-I\'m her intern.-Me too.

00:28:27.375 --> 00:28:30.917
You\'re an intern? Show me your card.

00:28:32.500 --> 00:28:36.125
His family is here...

00:28:39.458 --> 00:28:41.040
-Can I enter? -Hang on.

00:28:41.041 --> 00:28:46.917
Move away from the door, when
you can enter, you will.

00:29:07.875 --> 00:29:10.499
Everything\'s under control.

00:29:10.500 --> 00:29:18.082
We explained to the judge that we
have a big problem in human terms.

00:29:18.083 --> 00:29:21.290
If we plead guilty to
two attempted murders,

00:29:21.291 --> 00:29:27.707
maybe the court will
rulebefore his 14th birthday,

00:29:27.708 --> 00:29:29.165
and maybe he won\'t go to prison,

00:29:29.166 --> 00:29:33.833
but rather six years in a juvenile center.

00:29:33.834 --> 00:29:37.874
- A closed facility. -A
center for delinquent youth.

00:29:37.875 --> 00:29:42.082
But the judge said: \"I
understand the problem.

00:29:42.083 --> 00:29:46.958
I understand the conflict,
the contradiction.

00:29:46.959 --> 00:29:51.541
Even if you admit to two
attempted murders,\"

00:29:51.542 --> 00:29:56.207
said the judge, \"I\'ll
bring the kid before me.

00:29:56.208 --> 00:30:00.040
I\'ll ask him: \'Do you plead guilty?\'

00:30:00.041 --> 00:30:05.624
And if he doesn\'t say: \'Yes,
my intent was to murder!\'

00:30:05.625 --> 00:30:10.666
I won\'t accept his plea.
We\'ll go to trial.\"

00:30:10.667 --> 00:30:14.082
- But his intentwasn\'t to
murder.-That\'s right.

00:30:14.083 --> 00:30:19.207
If he didn\'t intend to kill,
why should we say he did?

00:30:19.208 --> 00:30:22.499
We\'re taking a chance. It\'s risky.

00:30:22.500 --> 00:30:25.707
But I believe we have to take the chance.

00:30:25.708 --> 00:30:30.249
Because his conscience,
your conscience, and ours,

00:30:30.250 --> 00:30:34.582
are more importantthan what will come.

00:30:34.583 --> 00:30:36.499
That\'s what I think.

00:30:36.500 --> 00:30:41.875
And no one can guaranteewhat is to come.

00:30:42.166 --> 00:30:44.416
[reporter]The hearing just ended.

00:30:44.417 --> 00:30:50.165
This case entails one
of the worst conflicts

00:30:50.166 --> 00:30:52.791
in the criminal justice system.

00:30:52.792 --> 00:30:58.582
And one of the worst conflicts I\'ve
encountered in my long career.

00:30:58.583 --> 00:31:04.874
Do we take advantageof the
fact thathe\'s under age 14,

00:31:04.875 --> 00:31:10.582
and expedite legal proceedings,
before he can be sent to prison?

00:31:10.583 --> 00:31:15.958
But doing so would require him to
admit to two attempted murders.

00:31:15.959 --> 00:31:22.332
Despite the fact that this kid
is sticking to his version:

00:31:22.333 --> 00:31:25.499
\"I had no intent to murder anyone.\"

00:31:25.500 --> 00:31:32.082
So even if we stand to gain something
by pleading guilty to attempted murder,

00:31:32.083 --> 00:31:36.582
if he won\'t do it, I can\'t do it for him

00:31:36.583 --> 00:31:39.457
and the court won\'t
accept a false admission.

00:31:39.458 --> 00:31:45.625
But he could pay a heavy
pricefor that position.

00:31:45.959 --> 00:31:47.959
It\'s always heavy.

00:31:56.166 --> 00:31:58.666
Today, Palestinian TV aired a clip

00:31:58.667 --> 00:32:01.082
from the interrogation of Ahmad ♪*♪*♪*♪*,

00:32:01.083 --> 00:32:06.082
who was involved in the
stabbing attack in Pisgat Zeev,

00:32:06.083 --> 00:32:09.749
in which a 13-year-old Jewish
kid was stabbed. Let\'s watch.

00:32:09.750 --> 00:32:12.541
- [interrogator] Look!
-[Ahmad] I really don\'t...

00:32:12.542 --> 00:32:16.290
[interrogator] What do you mean \"really\"?

00:32:16.291 --> 00:32:17.707
You little liar!

00:32:17.708 --> 00:32:20.541
-Why did you stab him? -[Ahmad sputters]

00:32:20.542 --> 00:32:23.041
[interrogator]Why did you stab him?

00:32:23.125 --> 00:32:24.499
I don\'t...

00:32:24.500 --> 00:32:26.249
I\'m askingwhy you stabbed him!

00:32:26.250 --> 00:32:30.249
-I don\'t know! -Why did you stab him?

00:32:30.250 --> 00:32:31.374
I don\'t remember!

00:32:31.375 --> 00:32:33.666
[sobbing]I don\'t remember, I\'m going mad!

00:32:33.667 --> 00:32:39.165
- I don\'t remember, take me to a doctor!
- Why did you stab him?

00:32:39.166 --> 00:32:41.541
-I don\'t remember!-[interrogator] Stop it!

00:32:41.542 --> 00:32:44.541
Put your hands down! Sit up straight!

00:32:44.542 --> 00:32:46.833
Why did you stab himwith a knife?

00:32:46.834 --> 00:32:48.582
NHands down!

00:32:48.583 --> 00:32:49.542
NWhy did you stab him?

00:32:49.543 --> 00:32:52.791
[Ahmad]I can\'t remember,
I\'m losing my mind!

00:32:52.792 --> 00:32:55.457
-Why did you stab him? -I don\'t remember!

00:32:55.458 --> 00:32:57.666
I asked you, Ahmad, nwhy did you stab him?

00:32:57.667 --> 00:33:00.541
I really don\'t remember.

00:33:00.542 --> 00:33:02.916
I really can\'t rememberna thing.

00:33:02.917 --> 00:33:08.541
I see the surveillance footagenand
don\'t remember anything.

00:33:08.542 --> 00:33:11.541
[newscaster] The 13-year-old who
stabbed another 13-year-old...

00:33:11.542 --> 00:33:16.750
The interrogation of a kid
with a cracked skull.

00:33:35.000 --> 00:33:40.124
[Michel] 1972, was two things.

00:33:40.125 --> 00:33:45.666
It\'s the year that Nissan,
our elder child, was born.

00:33:45.667 --> 00:33:51.666
And it\'s Lea\'s entry into political trials.

00:33:51.667 --> 00:33:58.499
In fact, her very first trialwas
the Arab-Jewish underground.

00:33:58.500 --> 00:34:03.541
It\'s a story that\'s hardto imagine today.

00:34:03.542 --> 00:34:09.499
Israeli Jews dared to join
an Arab national movement.

00:34:09.500 --> 00:34:12.541
It was like an atomic bomb
had fallen on Israel.

00:34:12.542 --> 00:34:20.542
[newscaster] The defendants are accused of
grave charges like aiding the enemy in war.

00:34:21.625 --> 00:34:22.500
On the docket:

00:34:22.501 --> 00:34:27.958
Daoud Turki is accused
ofnrecruiting the group\'s members.

00:34:27.959 --> 00:34:29.791
He\'s the one who broughtJews into the fold.

00:34:29.792 --> 00:34:34.124
Udi Adiv, according to the charges,
nrevealed classified information

00:34:34.125 --> 00:34:39.542
about the IDF paratrooper
unit in which he\'d served.

00:34:40.458 --> 00:34:43.749
[Lea] Udi was a comrade

00:34:43.750 --> 00:34:49.249
and one day, out of the
blue, he was arrested.

00:34:49.250 --> 00:34:55.290
As a member of a Jewish-Arab
underground group that went to Syria.

00:34:55.291 --> 00:34:59.457
We too were shocked.

00:34:59.458 --> 00:35:01.833
Ties with Arabs? Of course!

00:35:01.834 --> 00:35:04.332
Even with Arabs across the border.

00:35:04.333 --> 00:35:06.541
But ideological ties!

00:35:06.542 --> 00:35:09.833
Not \"espionage,\" of which he was accused.

00:35:09.834 --> 00:35:16.207
LONG LIVE JOINT ARAB-JEWISH STRUGGLE

00:35:16.208 --> 00:35:19.999
[Michel]One must understand the context.

00:35:20.000 --> 00:35:23.874
The national consensus is total.

00:35:23.875 --> 00:35:30.457
We\'re only five years past
1967,and Israel\'s still euphoric.

00:35:30.458 --> 00:35:33.749
There was only one group, \"Matzpen,\"

00:35:33.750 --> 00:35:37.916
and later the underground, that
took things a step further,

00:35:37.917 --> 00:35:41.332
that communicated the opposite message.

00:35:41.333 --> 00:35:44.791
Today, that message is trivial:
\"There\'s an occupation,

00:35:44.792 --> 00:35:49.165
there are Palestinians, they have rights.\"

00:35:49.166 --> 00:35:50.207
It sounds banal.

00:35:50.208 --> 00:35:51.833
Back then, it sounded revolutionary.

00:35:51.834 --> 00:35:54.541
[Udi Adiv] What I intended to do,

00:35:54.542 --> 00:35:56.958
and all I intended to do,

00:35:56.959 --> 00:35:57.792
is a revolution.

00:35:57.793 --> 00:36:03.582
For the sake of both Jews
and Arabs in this land.

00:36:03.583 --> 00:36:04.542
I never thought...

00:36:04.543 --> 00:36:08.416
- [judge] Did you intend to aid the enemy?
- Absolutely not.

00:36:08.417 --> 00:36:12.541
[Lea] And he was depictedas a monster.

00:36:12.542 --> 00:36:16.249
I went to defend the
monster and his friends.

00:36:16.250 --> 00:36:23.290
I went to defendJewish-Arab cooperation,
for the sake of a better future.

00:36:23.291 --> 00:36:28.666
I refused to throw the baby
out with the bath water,

00:36:28.667 --> 00:36:32.834
to let them consider cooperation invalid.

00:36:34.250 --> 00:36:36.916
LOST REVOLUTIONARIES

00:36:36.917 --> 00:36:38.958
IDEOLOGICAL ENEMIES

00:36:38.959 --> 00:36:42.582
COURT IS NOT A POLITICAL STAGE

00:36:42.583 --> 00:36:44.290
JUDGES DENY CLAIMS OF TORTURE

00:36:44.291 --> 00:36:48.707
[newscaster] Today\'s hearing was
devoted to the defendant\'s claims that

00:36:48.708 --> 00:36:55.082
his eight confessions were extracted
with coercion, beatings and threats.

00:36:55.083 --> 00:36:57.624
I told my interrogator:

00:36:57.625 --> 00:37:00.207
\"It seems you want to eliminate me.

00:37:00.208 --> 00:37:05.666
You\'re threatening me by sayingyou\'ve
eliminated people before.

00:37:05.667 --> 00:37:12.374
So just eliminate me! Why
torture, question, intimidate?\"

00:37:12.375 --> 00:37:13.333
He said: \"No!

00:37:13.334 --> 00:37:17.958
Don\'t think we\'ll kill you all at once.

00:37:17.959 --> 00:37:20.541
We\'ll kill you a thousand times.

00:37:20.542 --> 00:37:24.250
And you\'ll leave this place a mad man.\"

00:37:24.375 --> 00:37:27.249
[Lea] It was one after
another, always the same.

00:37:27.250 --> 00:37:32.332
They all described the shackling,
sleep deprivation, deafening music,

00:37:32.333 --> 00:37:35.207
interrogations day and
night, and the beatings.

00:37:35.208 --> 00:37:38.791
It clearly wasn\'t the whim
of a sole interrogator,

00:37:38.792 --> 00:37:40.958
it was systematic.

00:37:40.959 --> 00:37:45.332
There were instructions,
like a user manual.

00:37:45.333 --> 00:37:48.874
How to cause the human
body pain and suffering.

00:37:48.875 --> 00:37:53.707
How to cause pain and suffering,
without leaving marks.

00:37:53.708 --> 00:37:59.499
How to cause the human body
pain and suffering, so that...

00:37:59.500 --> 00:38:05.000
the detainee remains conscious
and keeps answering questions.

00:38:05.917 --> 00:38:11.082
[judge] We have no doubtthat the
defendant\'sclaims about torture,

00:38:11.083 --> 00:38:16.582
are the figment of his imagination,
and we do not believe him.

00:38:16.583 --> 00:38:22.332
We\'re convinced he confessed
of his own free will,

00:38:22.333 --> 00:38:26.290
and we approve them as
evidence in this trial.

00:38:26.291 --> 00:38:28.582
[Lea] The confession is
the \"queen of evidence,\"

00:38:28.583 --> 00:38:32.124
and they\'ll do anything to get it.

00:38:32.125 --> 00:38:35.624
With a confession, be it true or false,

00:38:35.625 --> 00:38:37.207
his fate is sealed.

00:38:37.208 --> 00:38:43.332
TURKI AND ADIV SENTENCED TO 17 YEARS

00:38:43.333 --> 00:38:48.374
ADVOCATE TSEMEL IDENTIFIES
WITH THE ENEMIES OF THE STATE

00:38:48.375 --> 00:38:53.916
Two things happened in 1972,
Nini\'s birth and the trial.

00:38:53.917 --> 00:38:58.332
I\'d say the trial symbolized Nini\'s life,

00:38:58.333 --> 00:39:00.874
from that day on.

00:39:00.875 --> 00:39:05.749
He became secondary to her total devotion

00:39:05.750 --> 00:39:10.041
to the defense of political prisoners.

00:39:12.125 --> 00:39:15.249
One day, we were walking together.

00:39:15.250 --> 00:39:18.749
That didn\'t happen often.

00:39:18.750 --> 00:39:22.582
I guess she had the afternoon off.

00:39:22.583 --> 00:39:24.791
A man passes us on the street.

00:39:24.792 --> 00:39:28.833
\"Are you Lea Tsemel?\"She
says: \"Who\'s asking?\"

00:39:28.834 --> 00:39:31.666
With concern in her voice.

00:39:31.667 --> 00:39:35.374
He opens his jacket, points at a gun,

00:39:35.375 --> 00:39:39.165
and explains that they know who she is,

00:39:39.166 --> 00:39:40.791
and she should watch out.

00:39:40.792 --> 00:39:46.999
She responds with a juicy curse,
that he doesn\'t scare her,

00:39:47.000 --> 00:39:51.499
and that their threats
only make her stronger.

00:39:51.500 --> 00:39:53.499
He keeps walking and so do we.

00:39:53.500 --> 00:39:57.374
I asked: \"Why do you haveto do this work?

00:39:57.375 --> 00:40:00.707
It\'s not fun for me!\"

00:40:00.708 --> 00:40:03.958
And she said: \"I can\'t do anything else.

00:40:03.959 --> 00:40:06.125
I believe in it.\"

00:40:09.708 --> 00:40:12.707
What? You\'re out of your mind.

00:40:12.708 --> 00:40:14.917
Unbelievable.

00:40:15.250 --> 00:40:20.290
Traffic schmaffic, come on! You
have a meeting in Ramallah.

00:40:20.291 --> 00:40:27.582
Quit the nonsense and
come to the office now!

00:40:27.583 --> 00:40:29.499
When?

00:40:29.500 --> 00:40:31.707
No! It doesn\'t work like that!

00:40:31.708 --> 00:40:35.458
How will you get to courtby 8:30?

00:40:36.417 --> 00:40:37.000
Tareq...

00:40:37.001 --> 00:40:42.874
What\'s his name... Yasser! Yasser! Yasser!

00:40:42.875 --> 00:40:46.749
These are leading precedents
in juvenile cases.

00:40:46.750 --> 00:40:51.833
Review them to see what\'s
relevant to our case.

00:40:51.834 --> 00:40:55.583
Not during work hours!

00:40:58.166 --> 00:40:59.624
Ossama, come here a minute.

00:40:59.625 --> 00:41:04.875
I wanted to talk to Tareq,
but he\'s a no-show.

00:41:07.250 --> 00:41:10.124
In any event, where\'s the accused?

00:41:10.125 --> 00:41:14.040
Without parental presence,
from the first interrogation.

00:41:14.041 --> 00:41:15.624
\"I didn\'t stab...\"

00:41:15.625 --> 00:41:18.625
\"I tossed the knife...\"

00:41:22.625 --> 00:41:24.165
\"Why did you wantto be a martyr?\"

00:41:24.166 --> 00:41:25.499
\"I have the rightto remain silent.

00:41:25.500 --> 00:41:32.207
I\'ll tell you: because you shoot
war missiles at the kids in Gaza.

00:41:32.208 --> 00:41:35.499
You destroy their homes, poor kids.\"

00:41:35.500 --> 00:41:38.624
\"So you wanted to kill
Jewsbecause the Jews kill you.

00:41:38.625 --> 00:41:42.875
You wanted to avenge the
deaths of Muslims.\"

00:41:43.208 --> 00:41:46.833
\"No! Just to scare them so
they\'ll stop killing us.\"

00:41:46.834 --> 00:41:50.291
He doesn\'t admit to wanting to kill.

00:41:51.917 --> 00:41:52.875
Oy, oy, oy...

00:41:52.876 --> 00:41:59.041
This is his final confession,
his words are very clear.

00:41:59.583 --> 00:42:02.958
I\'m sure of my decision on how to plea.

00:42:02.959 --> 00:42:07.166
It\'s hard to convincethe
masses, but I\'m sure.

00:42:12.166 --> 00:42:13.125
Who do you represent?

00:42:13.126 --> 00:42:14.582
I represent the stabbing victims.

00:42:14.583 --> 00:42:20.040
[reporter] Do you know for a fact
that Ahmad took part in the stabbing?

00:42:20.041 --> 00:42:22.582
Or was he just part of the incident?

00:42:22.583 --> 00:42:24.374
-That\'s our opinion. -[reporter] That?

00:42:24.375 --> 00:42:30.124
That Ahmad was partof the incident,
and can\'tbe separated from it.

00:42:30.125 --> 00:42:31.791
But he didn\'t stab anyone.

00:42:31.792 --> 00:42:38.541
We\'re not discussing the charges,
as per the court\'s orders.

00:42:38.542 --> 00:42:41.666
Now you pissed me off! Okay.

00:42:41.667 --> 00:42:44.165
Now I\'m going to talk!

00:42:44.166 --> 00:42:46.833
[lawyer] Show me how it\'s done.

00:42:46.834 --> 00:42:49.207
[man]Lea, stand in the middle.

00:42:49.208 --> 00:42:52.041
Where\'s the middle?

00:42:54.291 --> 00:42:57.332
- [woman] Lea, move this way.
- [Lea] 1,2,3...

00:42:57.333 --> 00:42:58.958
The charges against this boy...

00:42:58.959 --> 00:43:03.290
Where\'s my co-counsel? Where\'s Tareq?
Tareq!

00:43:03.291 --> 00:43:04.582
-Should I call him? -Yes.

00:43:04.583 --> 00:43:06.541
-[woman] It\'s not nice to yell. -Who cares!

00:43:06.542 --> 00:43:10.457
- Enough, enough!-[man]
You\'re covering her face!

00:43:10.458 --> 00:43:11.916
Okay. I don\'t want this one.

00:43:11.917 --> 00:43:18.040
The indictment charges this minor,
boy under the imprisonable age,

00:43:18.041 --> 00:43:19.582
with two countsof attempted murder.

00:43:19.583 --> 00:43:25.916
None of his confessions mention
intent to murder, to the contrary!

00:43:25.917 --> 00:43:28.666
He was asked if he intended to murder,

00:43:28.667 --> 00:43:32.416
and his unequivocal responsewas: \"No!\"

00:43:32.417 --> 00:43:38.958
He states in all his interrogations,
even under extreme duress,

00:43:38.959 --> 00:43:43.249
that he and his cousin
agreed from the outset

00:43:43.250 --> 00:43:47.165
not to hurt women, children or the elderly.

00:43:47.166 --> 00:43:52.040
And when he saw his cousin
eyeing the kid on the bike,

00:43:52.041 --> 00:43:56.582
he said: \"Haram, he\'s just a kid!\"

00:43:56.583 --> 00:43:58.290
Meaning: \"It\'s forbidden.\"

00:43:58.291 --> 00:44:01.541
\"He\'s a boy, don\'t hurt him.\"

00:44:01.542 --> 00:44:02.624
The indictment,

00:44:02.625 --> 00:44:05.999
more or less describes
what indeed took place.

00:44:06.000 --> 00:44:09.666
Save for the attributionof intent!

00:44:09.667 --> 00:44:11.541
The intent to murder,

00:44:11.542 --> 00:44:12.916
the intent to cause death.

00:44:12.917 --> 00:44:16.666
There the indictment is wrong
and completely baseless.

00:44:16.667 --> 00:44:21.332
[reporter] Lea, if you
aren\'t pleading guilty,

00:44:21.333 --> 00:44:26.457
to avoid a prison term due to his age,

00:44:26.458 --> 00:44:28.165
what\'s your game plan?

00:44:28.166 --> 00:44:29.332
We\'re putting our trust

00:44:29.333 --> 00:44:36.416
in the court\'s veracity and integrity.

00:44:36.417 --> 00:44:40.707
Both justice and the lawwarrant them,

00:44:40.708 --> 00:44:44.249
and we\'ll obtain them.

00:44:44.250 --> 00:44:45.582
[in Arabic]You have all my respect!

00:44:45.583 --> 00:44:50.874
- [Lea] It\'s been many years.
- Hat\'s off to you!

00:44:50.875 --> 00:44:54.207
Thank you so much.

00:44:54.208 --> 00:44:57.541
You\'re one of a kind!

00:44:57.542 --> 00:45:00.083
I\'ve known her for 30 years!

00:45:02.458 --> 00:45:03.166
So?

00:45:03.167 --> 00:45:05.541
-What? -[man] You\'re mistaken.

00:45:05.542 --> 00:45:08.582
- You should have pleaded
guilty.-Are you crazy?

00:45:08.583 --> 00:45:11.499
Who\'s to saywhen they\'ll convict?

00:45:11.500 --> 00:45:16.124
Convict? Nonsense, there\'s no basis.

00:45:16.125 --> 00:45:18.249
You wanna bet?

00:45:18.250 --> 00:45:21.041
Abraham, Isaac, Jacob.

00:45:29.875 --> 00:45:36.375
- [crowd clamoring] -[woman]
This is a terrorist court!

00:45:36.792 --> 00:45:40.375
This is a racist court!

00:45:46.834 --> 00:45:50.166
Children of Palestine!

00:45:51.333 --> 00:45:53.582
Ahmad, Ahmad...

00:45:53.583 --> 00:45:56.583
Children of Palestine!

00:46:05.625 --> 00:46:07.457
Death to the murderers!

00:46:07.458 --> 00:46:10.332
Death to the murderers!

00:46:10.333 --> 00:46:13.541
The defendants enterednthe
courtroom one after another.

00:46:13.542 --> 00:46:19.541
[newscaster] In front ofthe cameras, they
act confidentnand wave to their relatives.

00:46:19.542 --> 00:46:24.249
They are accused of killing six Jews

00:46:24.250 --> 00:46:26.707
in the Beit Hadassah settlementnin Hebron,

00:46:26.708 --> 00:46:29.791
and injuring 16 others.

00:46:29.792 --> 00:46:32.290
The defendants chose to
make political statements,

00:46:32.291 --> 00:46:37.249
claiming they\'re soldiers who
aren\'t fighting the Jews as such,

00:46:37.250 --> 00:46:40.833
but rather defending their lands and homes.

00:46:40.834 --> 00:46:46.582
Defense attorney Nasser Darwishnargued
that this military court

00:46:46.583 --> 00:46:49.374
doesn\'t have the authority
to prosecute the defendants,

00:46:49.375 --> 00:46:52.416
seeing as they are \"prisoners of war.\"

00:46:52.417 --> 00:46:57.542
That was the line of defensenadvanced
by Attorney Lea Tsemel.

00:47:01.792 --> 00:47:07.416
[Lea] The Beit Hadassah
trial was exceptional.

00:47:07.417 --> 00:47:11.457
It was one of the first times
a settlement was attacked,

00:47:11.458 --> 00:47:16.833
hitting its symbolic heart,
Beit Hadassah in Hebron.

00:47:16.834 --> 00:47:22.541
A well-trained group of fighters

00:47:22.542 --> 00:47:26.750
tried and succeeded to carry out their aim.

00:47:28.125 --> 00:47:31.207
They were a very political group.

00:47:31.208 --> 00:47:35.749
They demanded to be recognized
as combatants who waged

00:47:35.750 --> 00:47:39.624
a legitimate war against an
illegitimate occupation,

00:47:39.625 --> 00:47:45.250
and thus are unwilling to be
judged by the occupation\'s court.

00:47:46.333 --> 00:47:50.499
It\'s rare for a lawyer
to encounter a client

00:47:50.500 --> 00:47:54.958
who is willing to stick to his principles

00:47:54.959 --> 00:47:56.624
and doesn\'t sell out.

00:47:56.625 --> 00:48:02.833
It\'s an honor to stand beside
him, without mounting a defense.

00:48:02.834 --> 00:48:06.916
[newscaster] \"The defendants
are beasts,\" said the judges,

00:48:06.917 --> 00:48:08.332
\"devoid of humanity.

00:48:08.333 --> 00:48:12.207
It was premeditated, cold-blooded murder.

00:48:12.208 --> 00:48:14.749
It must be retributed harshly.

00:48:14.750 --> 00:48:16.791
Their crime is punishable by death.

00:48:16.792 --> 00:48:20.416
However, these terrorists will
be sentenced to life in prison.\"

00:48:20.417 --> 00:48:23.040
The reactioncould be heard outside.

00:48:23.041 --> 00:48:25.165
[crowd] Death to the murderers!

00:48:25.166 --> 00:48:27.416
Death to the murderers!

00:48:27.417 --> 00:48:29.290
[interviewer] Why aren\'t
you in the footage,

00:48:29.291 --> 00:48:31.374
when you were the leading
lawyer on the case?

00:48:31.375 --> 00:48:35.833
[Lea chuckles] There were many journalists

00:48:35.834 --> 00:48:37.833
and the mood was extra hostile.

00:48:37.834 --> 00:48:45.624
I didn\'t want to enter the courtroom
and catch hell in front of the press,

00:48:45.625 --> 00:48:48.624
and let them documentthe
yelling and cursing.

00:48:48.625 --> 00:48:52.999
It\'s an image that I don\'t
want anyone to see.

00:48:53.000 --> 00:48:58.207
Even though they managed to
capture them spitting on me,

00:48:58.208 --> 00:49:01.083
but nothing more.

00:49:03.000 --> 00:49:05.040
I was pregnant,

00:49:05.041 --> 00:49:08.666
and I had to pass through them.

00:49:08.667 --> 00:49:14.959
And one of them said: \"May you
give birth to a monster!\"

00:49:15.208 --> 00:49:17.124
It stuck with me, that curse.

00:49:17.125 --> 00:49:20.541
I didn\'t give birth to a monster,

00:49:20.542 --> 00:49:22.040
far from it!

00:49:22.041 --> 00:49:27.582
But the curse, the spell he put on me,

00:49:27.583 --> 00:49:29.959
angered me.

00:49:30.041 --> 00:49:33.083
It infuriated me.

00:49:34.750 --> 00:49:39.582
People ask me if I\'m afraid to walk around

00:49:39.583 --> 00:49:43.374
in the world, in Israel, in Jerusalem,

00:49:43.375 --> 00:49:45.082
as her daughter.

00:49:45.083 --> 00:49:47.999
My feeling is just the opposite.

00:49:48.000 --> 00:49:52.875
It\'s as if by being on the front lines...

00:49:53.250 --> 00:49:58.124
she protects me too.

00:49:58.125 --> 00:50:00.958
As if I have merit points,

00:50:00.959 --> 00:50:04.374
that I didn\'t earn, but belong to me too.

00:50:04.375 --> 00:50:07.457
[in Arabic] \"I\'m Lea Tsemel\'s daughter!\"

00:50:07.458 --> 00:50:11.457
[in Hebrew] My friends and
family, my husband too,

00:50:11.458 --> 00:50:12.958
all know that if in trouble, yell:

00:50:12.959 --> 00:50:16.290
\"I\'m Lea Tsemel\'s daughter,\"
no matter the trouble.

00:50:16.291 --> 00:50:20.374
It\'s like a magic spell that will save us.

00:50:20.375 --> 00:50:24.250
I totally believe in the spell.

00:50:24.834 --> 00:50:27.917
[interviewer]Does she have red lines?

00:50:34.083 --> 00:50:37.375
I don\'t think so.[chuckles]

00:50:41.583 --> 00:50:46.582
[Lea] When I ask myself about
red lines, I ask it in reverse.

00:50:46.583 --> 00:50:48.499
I don\'t have a moral conflict

00:50:48.500 --> 00:50:52.332
with saying: \"Yes,\" but with saying: \"No.\"

00:50:52.333 --> 00:50:56.916
That\'s my contemplation, when
am I allowed to say: \"No\"?

00:50:56.917 --> 00:51:03.416
So I set the following
\"framework\" for myself:

00:51:03.417 --> 00:51:07.124
I\'m an Israeli occupier,
no matter what I do.

00:51:07.125 --> 00:51:12.707
I \"enjoy\" the fruits of occupation,
both bitter and sweet.

00:51:12.708 --> 00:51:18.958
And I didn\'t manage, despite my
moral obligation as an Israeli,

00:51:18.959 --> 00:51:25.000
to change the regime and its policies.

00:51:25.667 --> 00:51:31.541
On what moral groundsshould
I judge the people

00:51:31.542 --> 00:51:33.916
who resist my occupation?

00:51:33.917 --> 00:51:38.249
And hand out grades:
\"That\'s good, that\'s bad.\"

00:51:38.250 --> 00:51:40.791
If you\'re a non-violent demonstrator

00:51:40.792 --> 00:51:42.165
and they shoot you dead, you\'re good.

00:51:42.166 --> 00:51:47.499
But if you have a knifeand they
shoot you dead, you\'re bad.

00:51:47.500 --> 00:51:49.916
Who gave me that right?

00:51:49.917 --> 00:51:55.332
So, in that sense, if the act is intended

00:51:55.333 --> 00:52:02.542
to resist the occupation,
as such, I\'ll take it on.

00:52:06.041 --> 00:52:08.707
[in Arabic] There is no God but Allah!

00:52:08.708 --> 00:52:11.917
There is no God but Allah.

00:52:12.375 --> 00:52:13.499
It\'ll be okay.

00:52:13.500 --> 00:52:16.165
Come on, I have two hearings beforehand.

00:52:16.166 --> 00:52:19.625
-[Tareq] Now? -[Lea] Yes!

00:52:21.083 --> 00:52:24.916
I have a stomach achebecause
of the hearing.

00:52:24.917 --> 00:52:27.833
I haven\'t felt like thisin a long time.

00:52:27.834 --> 00:52:31.249
-Yours doesn\'t hurt? -No!

00:52:31.250 --> 00:52:34.834
I\'m ready for battle, as they say.

00:52:52.041 --> 00:52:54.791
Where do you want to talk to him?

00:52:54.792 --> 00:53:02.125
I wouldn\'t mind sittingon
that bench over there.

00:53:08.625 --> 00:53:11.374
[indistinct chatter]

00:53:11.375 --> 00:53:16.332
I\'m going to read your
own words back to you.

00:53:16.333 --> 00:53:19.332
The same exact words you spoke

00:53:19.333 --> 00:53:21.541
when you withstood police interrogation,

00:53:21.542 --> 00:53:25.124
when those nasty interrogators
screamed at you.

00:53:25.125 --> 00:53:28.499
If you\'re clever here too,
the court will love you.

00:53:28.500 --> 00:53:31.874
They\'ll love you, okay? And I will too.

00:53:31.875 --> 00:53:34.249
-Come sit, Tareq.-[Tareq] No.

00:53:34.250 --> 00:53:36.999
So you can talk to him too.

00:53:37.000 --> 00:53:40.874
[Lea] \"What was your aim?\"
Let\'s talk about your aim.

00:53:40.875 --> 00:53:43.582
They asked: \"What did
youwant to do to the Jews?\"

00:53:43.583 --> 00:53:46.457
-What did you answer? -[Ahmad] Scare them.

00:53:46.458 --> 00:53:47.582
\"Nothing but scare them.\"

00:53:47.583 --> 00:53:51.791
I\'m reading your own words, if you
don\'t understand, he can read.

00:53:51.792 --> 00:53:56.332
Who do you prefer? Whose Arabic is better?

00:53:56.333 --> 00:54:01.207
- [all chuckle] -Okay, read
it to him word for word.

00:54:01.208 --> 00:54:05.082
[Tareq] \"We weren\'t... I
didn\'t stab anyone...\"

00:54:05.083 --> 00:54:07.707
[Ahmad] She reads better!

00:54:07.708 --> 00:54:09.833
[Lea] I knew he\'d say that!

00:54:09.834 --> 00:54:13.082
[Tareq] \"We went to stab Jews,
but I didn\'t stab anyone.\"

00:54:13.083 --> 00:54:16.208
\"Why?\"\"Because I was scared.\"

00:54:17.959 --> 00:54:20.874
[Lea]He tried to make you
sayyou\'re against the Jews,

00:54:20.875 --> 00:54:28.875
but you didn\'t fall for it,
because it\'s not true.

00:54:33.667 --> 00:54:38.290
-[woman 1] Muhammad? -[woman 2] Ahmad!

00:54:38.291 --> 00:54:40.208
No!

00:54:40.375 --> 00:54:42.207
-[Lea] He\'s shy!-Don\'t be shy!

00:54:42.208 --> 00:54:45.082
I\'m also like your mother!

00:54:45.083 --> 00:54:49.582
All Palestinian mothersare mothers to you.

00:54:49.583 --> 00:54:50.417
[laughs]

00:54:50.418 --> 00:54:54.916
How are you, Ahmad? We\'re all your mothers.

00:54:54.917 --> 00:54:56.833
Not just your own mother.

00:54:56.834 --> 00:54:59.165
All Palestinian women are your mothers!

00:54:59.166 --> 00:55:02.874
Every martyr\'s mother,
every prisoner\'s mother...

00:55:02.875 --> 00:55:05.541
Girls, girls!

00:55:05.542 --> 00:55:06.417
Take it easy.

00:55:06.418 --> 00:55:14.418
He has an important task ahead,
testimony, let him concentrate.

00:55:28.417 --> 00:55:33.291
THE HEARING IS HELD BEHIND CLOSED DOORS

00:55:52.542 --> 00:55:58.041
- [Lea] Don\'t tell me to
consult.-[Tareq] Consult!

00:55:59.500 --> 00:56:04.290
- I told you we have to show them that...
- [Lea] What?

00:56:04.291 --> 00:56:08.833
That the entire country
rallied against this kid!

00:56:08.834 --> 00:56:10.874
-[Lea] Why are you mad at me? -I\'m not mad.

00:56:10.875 --> 00:56:14.124
-[Lea] Be honest, tell me. -I\'m not mad.

00:56:14.125 --> 00:56:15.125
What disappointed you?

00:56:15.126 --> 00:56:20.374
I\'m disappointed that when I
proceeded with the right tactic,

00:56:20.375 --> 00:56:23.916
you didn\'t listen to me, so I stopped.

00:56:23.917 --> 00:56:28.916
But when the judges told you:
\"Do it this way,\" you listened.

00:56:28.917 --> 00:56:34.916
We have to be on the same page, next time.

00:56:34.917 --> 00:56:36.290
We have to be in sync.

00:56:36.291 --> 00:56:39.833
Otherwise, they\'ll say:
\"The best lawyers around,

00:56:39.834 --> 00:56:44.542
just because oftheir
differences of opinion...\"

00:56:44.625 --> 00:56:45.417
They\'d say that?

00:56:45.418 --> 00:56:50.291
You don\'t understand. People
will say worse than that.

00:56:52.750 --> 00:56:55.958
-But the kid did fine. -He was fine.

00:56:55.959 --> 00:57:02.874
I was a bit dry, you would\'ve
addedmore sauce, no?

00:57:02.875 --> 00:57:05.874
-Yeah. - \"What did you feel...\"

00:57:05.875 --> 00:57:08.124
Let the prosecutor ask him.

00:57:08.125 --> 00:57:10.875
Hey kid!

00:57:18.583 --> 00:57:22.499
When the judge saw the
knife, she went: \"Wow!\"

00:57:22.500 --> 00:57:27.582
- [Lea] It\'s a toy knife.-It\'s
a murderous knife!

00:57:27.583 --> 00:57:28.458
Come on!

00:57:28.459 --> 00:57:34.499
I can buy ten knives like itin
a souvenir shop in Spain.

00:57:34.500 --> 00:57:38.959
You don\'t slaughter sheep
with a knife like that.

00:57:39.583 --> 00:57:42.332
[Tareq]No, maybe youstab sheep with it...

00:57:42.333 --> 00:57:44.667
[all laugh]

00:57:45.083 --> 00:57:47.542
Come on.

00:57:54.959 --> 00:57:55.792
[Ossama] Lea...

00:57:55.793 --> 00:57:59.958
Why didn\'t you raise the claimthat
when he was interrogated...

00:57:59.959 --> 00:58:01.707
That he just wanted it to end?

00:58:01.708 --> 00:58:04.582
-Yeah! -No! You want to claim

00:58:04.583 --> 00:58:08.916
that he lied due to
trepidation and torture...

00:58:08.917 --> 00:58:10.833
But he didn\'t tell any lies!

00:58:10.834 --> 00:58:14.207
-Everything he said was true! -But no...

00:58:14.208 --> 00:58:15.290
Like today, he said:

00:58:15.291 --> 00:58:18.082
\"If they had tried to kill me,
I would\'ve stabbed them.\"

00:58:18.083 --> 00:58:24.624
Yes, and he means it!
Whatever he says is true!

00:58:24.625 --> 00:58:26.457
That\'s what\'s so brilliant
about his testimony.

00:58:26.458 --> 00:58:31.958
This boy speaks the truth, and
the truth can\'t be altered.

00:58:31.959 --> 00:58:34.666
That\'s why the scary
prosecutor doesn\'t scare him.

00:58:34.667 --> 00:58:39.499
The interrogator doesn\'t coerce
him into changing his mind.

00:58:39.500 --> 00:58:41.999
Because he sticks to the truth!

00:58:42.000 --> 00:58:45.416
How do you know whensomeone\'s
telling the truth?

00:58:45.417 --> 00:58:48.207
When they don\'t change their
mind, this way or that.

00:58:48.208 --> 00:58:54.707
Now, it happens in interrogations
that people make false confessions,

00:58:54.708 --> 00:58:56.958
because of dread, fear, horror.

00:58:56.959 --> 00:59:03.332
Had he lied, contesting his confessionwould
be relevant, but it\'s not!

00:59:03.333 --> 00:59:08.541
And our advantage vis-a-vis
the judges is to say:

00:59:08.542 --> 00:59:11.249
\"This is his version and
he\'s sticking to it.\"

00:59:11.250 --> 00:59:17.165
No matter how much they yell
at him, manipulate him,

00:59:17.166 --> 00:59:20.124
put words in his mouth.

00:59:20.125 --> 00:59:22.874
When they call it \"martyrdom,\"
it\'s their wording.

00:59:22.875 --> 00:59:26.582
Whatever they try, he
doesn\'t change his story.

00:59:26.583 --> 00:59:31.416
He\'s as consistent as can be,
that\'s what\'s great about him.

00:59:31.417 --> 00:59:32.999
Why say he admitted out of fear?

00:59:33.000 --> 00:59:37.749
Why should I say that he lied
just to end the interrogation?

00:59:37.750 --> 00:59:39.791
Look, a broomstick!

00:59:39.792 --> 00:59:41.374
I\'ve never seen a ruling that reads:

00:59:41.375 --> 00:59:49.375
\"Oh! It seems he was fed up with being
interrogated, so he told lies to end it.\"

01:00:04.708 --> 01:00:11.083
\"I Can\'t Understand the Parisians,\"
it\'s a song by Maurice Chevalier.

01:00:11.208 --> 01:00:12.958
If you ask me.

01:00:12.959 --> 01:00:17.374
♪ I can\'t understand The Parisians ♪

01:00:17.375 --> 01:00:22.834
♪ Making love Every time they... ♪

01:00:26.917 --> 01:00:28.749
No, thanks.

01:00:28.750 --> 01:00:31.583
[in English] Pure butter!

01:00:41.166 --> 01:00:45.165
[in Arabic] Here\'s why Tareq
and I thought we should talk.

01:00:45.166 --> 01:00:48.833
We still don\'t know what\'ll happen.

01:00:48.834 --> 01:00:52.916
We have a meeting scheduled
with the prosecution.

01:00:52.917 --> 01:00:54.541
We don\'t know what they\'ll say.

01:00:54.542 --> 01:01:02.542
If they want to make an example of Ahmad,
to teach all the other kids a lesson.

01:01:02.875 --> 01:01:07.457
Tareq prefers to know the outcome,

01:01:07.458 --> 01:01:08.916
he doesn\'t want to take any chances.

01:01:08.917 --> 01:01:14.916
We\'ll meet the prosecutionbut need
to knowwhat message to deliver.

01:01:14.917 --> 01:01:18.249
We are your messengers.

01:01:18.250 --> 01:01:22.207
Don\'t say: \"We want the best outcome!\"

01:01:22.208 --> 01:01:23.457
We\'ll aim for the best outcome.

01:01:23.458 --> 01:01:27.165
But if we don\'t succeed, what
will you find acceptable?

01:01:27.166 --> 01:01:28.874
The prosecutor told us:

01:01:28.875 --> 01:01:33.749
\"If you change your plea and admit
to two attempted murders today,

01:01:33.750 --> 01:01:34.791
we\'ll ask for six years.\"

01:01:34.792 --> 01:01:40.499
No, the boy didn\'t intend
to kill, and you know it!

01:01:40.500 --> 01:01:41.791
[Lea] I know!

01:01:41.792 --> 01:01:46.416
But the prosecutor is
talkingabout six years.

01:01:46.417 --> 01:01:49.374
If we plead guilty, he\'ll
agree to close on six.

01:01:49.375 --> 01:01:52.791
- [Ahmad\'s father] No, six is too much.
- I agree.

01:01:52.792 --> 01:02:00.207
- As a mother, I want my son...
- I want him back too.

01:02:00.208 --> 01:02:03.666
I can\'t even imagineone to two years.

01:02:03.667 --> 01:02:08.249
Yesterday, I cried a river.

01:02:08.250 --> 01:02:15.083
There\'s no guarantee regarding
the outcome, do you understand?

01:02:16.667 --> 01:02:18.707
But if the term is the same,

01:02:18.708 --> 01:02:21.249
where do you prefer him to do time?

01:02:21.250 --> 01:02:23.290
He\'s better off in juvenile detention.

01:02:23.291 --> 01:02:27.833
Okay, it\'s important for
me to hear that from you.

01:02:27.834 --> 01:02:31.708
-Okay, thank you.-Take care, dear.

01:02:32.959 --> 01:02:40.959
Well, at least they\'re not into the
heroic \"big prison\" narrative.

01:02:41.500 --> 01:02:45.124
Not at all.

01:02:45.125 --> 01:02:47.875
[dogs barking]

01:03:00.333 --> 01:03:03.707
[Lea in English] You know, the
two prisoners were killed.

01:03:03.708 --> 01:03:06.290
I say \"killed,\" because
me and the families,

01:03:06.291 --> 01:03:12.791
we see the prison authorities totally
responsible for their deaths.

01:03:12.792 --> 01:03:17.165
FREEDOM FOR POLITICAL PRISONERS

01:03:17.166 --> 01:03:20.624
FREEDOM FOR THE HUNGER STRIKERS

01:03:20.625 --> 01:03:21.707
They were force-fed.

01:03:21.708 --> 01:03:24.999
Whatever they were given,
which was very salty.

01:03:25.000 --> 01:03:28.249
Like the prisoners said,
\"the water of the Dead Sea,\"

01:03:28.250 --> 01:03:33.749
was given, by mistake, into the
lungs instead ofinto the stomach.

01:03:33.750 --> 01:03:36.582
That\'s the reason thatwe
see them responsible.

01:03:36.583 --> 01:03:44.583
[in Hebrew] Being someone\'s lawyer entails
more than just appearing in court

01:03:45.125 --> 01:03:47.457
and arguing their case passionately.

01:03:47.458 --> 01:03:52.624
It means being there for
them in their daily life.

01:03:52.625 --> 01:03:56.999
Especially if they\'re sentencedto
prison for political reasons.

01:03:57.000 --> 01:04:04.124
Given the miserable prison
conditions, I couldn\'t just say:

01:04:04.125 --> 01:04:08.582
\"Case closed,\" and drop the client.

01:04:08.583 --> 01:04:10.791
But in addition to political prisoners,

01:04:10.792 --> 01:04:12.541
there\'s the oppression of Palestinians:

01:04:12.542 --> 01:04:14.833
freedom of speech, freedom of the press.

01:04:14.834 --> 01:04:19.124
The suppression of student protests.

01:04:19.125 --> 01:04:22.958
It was all part of my daily workload,

01:04:22.959 --> 01:04:30.959
beyond the hardcore cases
involving armed resistance.

01:04:31.458 --> 01:04:36.082
Israeli policy in the Occupied Territories

01:04:36.083 --> 01:04:40.332
is one of repression,
dispossession and confiscation.

01:04:40.333 --> 01:04:43.249
Palestinians under occupation
have no civil rights.

01:04:43.250 --> 01:04:47.416
Youth in the Occupied
Territories are the most active

01:04:47.417 --> 01:04:51.749
in responding politically
to current events.

01:04:51.750 --> 01:04:56.041
[students chanting]

01:05:03.417 --> 01:05:05.040
[in English]I know for sure that this year,

01:05:05.041 --> 01:05:07.207
the students definitely
wereplanning on studying.

01:05:07.208 --> 01:05:11.791
And they were saying thatthey kept
trying to getto the university to work

01:05:11.792 --> 01:05:13.707
and they were beinghampered
by the military.

01:05:13.708 --> 01:05:18.082
[in Hebrew] Political leaders,
people with leadership potential,

01:05:18.083 --> 01:05:20.707
with the ability to influence,
are regularly detained.

01:05:20.708 --> 01:05:25.916
[woman in English] And I was arrested,
I was looking for a lawyer.

01:05:25.917 --> 01:05:27.499
And from that day on,

01:05:27.500 --> 01:05:33.499
Lea was really part of our experience
of struggle at Birzeit University.

01:05:33.500 --> 01:05:38.499
During all these closures, during
all these military incursions,

01:05:38.500 --> 01:05:41.707
the shootings, the arrests, and so on...

01:05:41.708 --> 01:05:44.958
It was Lea who was there all the time.

01:05:44.959 --> 01:05:47.749
[students chanting] Open Birzeit!

01:05:47.750 --> 01:05:50.708
Open Birzeit!

01:05:51.458 --> 01:05:55.499
[woman] To us, being a
prisoner is a fact of life.

01:05:55.500 --> 01:06:02.040
Every home, every family, has had
at least one prisoner, if not more.

01:06:02.041 --> 01:06:04.582
Many families have had \"martyrs.\"

01:06:04.583 --> 01:06:08.499
Many familieshave had people deported.

01:06:08.500 --> 01:06:11.249
Many families have had
their homes destroyed.

01:06:11.250 --> 01:06:17.207
But every family can tell you:
\"I have prisoners in my midst.

01:06:17.208 --> 01:06:20.666
The Israelis reached into
my home and extracted

01:06:20.667 --> 01:06:24.290
my son, my daughter, my
husband, my brother,

01:06:24.291 --> 01:06:26.707
and took him or her away.\"

01:06:26.708 --> 01:06:29.290
And it was Lea who was there saying:

01:06:29.291 --> 01:06:32.207
\"I will try to bring himor her back.\"

01:06:32.208 --> 01:06:36.374
Lea went to court, to help our students,

01:06:36.375 --> 01:06:39.791
and I was nursing, I was
breastfeeding Zeina,

01:06:39.792 --> 01:06:44.874
and Talila got hungry, so
I breastfed her as well.

01:06:44.875 --> 01:06:46.791
And so now, they\'re milk sisters.

01:06:46.792 --> 01:06:50.416
You see, in our tradition, when two babies

01:06:50.417 --> 01:06:53.999
are fed the same mother\'s
milk, they become sisters.

01:06:54.000 --> 01:06:56.499
And this is a very strong bond.

01:06:56.500 --> 01:07:01.207
[Lea]I really don\'t feel
the gapof a Palestinian,

01:07:01.208 --> 01:07:01.917
a Jew.

01:07:01.918 --> 01:07:04.582
I don\'t think we ever had it between us.

01:07:04.583 --> 01:07:06.040
[woman] She was very human.

01:07:06.041 --> 01:07:07.582
She was the only one, really,

01:07:07.583 --> 01:07:09.749
who recognized us inthe
Greek sense of anagnorisis.

01:07:09.750 --> 01:07:14.958
You know, I recognize your humanity
and what you\'re going through.

01:07:14.959 --> 01:07:17.374
If you are fighting against injustice,

01:07:17.375 --> 01:07:19.332
and you don\'t have any other tools,

01:07:19.333 --> 01:07:21.791
you adopt the tools that are available,

01:07:21.792 --> 01:07:23.207
you manufacture your own tools.

01:07:23.208 --> 01:07:25.624
Some people turn their bodies into tools.

01:07:25.625 --> 01:07:30.249
They don\'t have war planes
or tanks, they have bodies.

01:07:30.250 --> 01:07:33.082
It doesn\'t mean she condoned this
or she thought it was right,

01:07:33.083 --> 01:07:40.499
but she said you have to understand it
in the context in which this happened.

01:07:40.500 --> 01:07:44.541
This is a very difficultand rare situation.

01:07:44.542 --> 01:07:50.541
Where you could look at the
victim-cum-violent-person,

01:07:50.542 --> 01:07:52.416
and understandthe motives for violence

01:07:52.417 --> 01:07:59.332
and understand that this is a response
to a greater form of violence.

01:07:59.333 --> 01:08:03.958
You are not abstract labeled \"terrorists.\"

01:08:03.959 --> 01:08:06.792
[TV: news theme music]

01:08:11.917 --> 01:08:14.999
[newscaster in Hebrew] An escalation
in the current wave of terror.

01:08:15.000 --> 01:08:19.290
A female terrorist blew up
in her car at a checkpoint.

01:08:19.291 --> 01:08:22.249
Israa Jaabis, a 31-year-old
resident of East Jerusalem,

01:08:22.250 --> 01:08:27.666
had intended to blow up her car in the
city center. The policeman she injured...

01:08:27.667 --> 01:08:29.958
[newscaster 2 in Arabic]
The occupation, as usual,

01:08:29.959 --> 01:08:36.165
is accusing Israa Jaabisof
attempting to murdera policeman,

01:08:36.166 --> 01:08:37.916
after she was severely burned

01:08:37.917 --> 01:08:40.499
when her car exploded accidentally.

01:08:40.500 --> 01:08:44.249
[reporter] Are you suffering
from the pain, Israa?

01:08:44.250 --> 01:08:47.208
[Israa] What do you think?

01:08:47.417 --> 01:08:51.416
My pain is visible.

01:08:51.417 --> 01:08:55.124
[reporter]What about your
fingers, your hands?

01:08:55.125 --> 01:08:58.166
[Israa] I don\'t have fingers anymore.

01:09:00.875 --> 01:09:04.166
[Lea] Welcome, Jaabis!

01:09:04.792 --> 01:09:06.541
Should I take this case?

01:09:06.542 --> 01:09:10.624
-Hello. -[Lea] Hello, how are you?

01:09:10.625 --> 01:09:11.375
Cold.

01:09:11.376 --> 01:09:16.791
I want to know whatlsraa\'s
chances are in her case.

01:09:16.792 --> 01:09:20.707
[Lea] I haven\'t studied her file yet.

01:09:20.708 --> 01:09:24.249
I can\'t say, I don\'t know anything yet.

01:09:24.250 --> 01:09:29.416
[woman] She\'s innocent, nothing they\'re
claimingabout her is accurate.

01:09:29.417 --> 01:09:33.457
[Lea]Why do you think she\'s innocent?

01:09:33.458 --> 01:09:34.707
Tell me.

01:09:34.708 --> 01:09:38.416
Because she\'s not a person

01:09:38.417 --> 01:09:43.416
who\'d do this sort of thing.

01:09:43.417 --> 01:09:47.707
I need to read the file, to smell it.

01:09:47.708 --> 01:09:51.165
To know what it\'s telling us.

01:09:51.166 --> 01:09:52.000
Then we\'ll talk.

01:09:52.001 --> 01:09:54.624
You\'re telling me what
you think, no problem.

01:09:54.625 --> 01:09:58.916
But I still don\'t know what
the file is telling us.

01:09:58.917 --> 01:10:01.499
You\'re familiar with the charges?

01:10:01.500 --> 01:10:05.958
\"The accused, as detailed below,

01:10:05.959 --> 01:10:10.458
woke up at 4:30 in the morning

01:10:10.708 --> 01:10:12.040
to pray with her husband.

01:10:12.041 --> 01:10:16.374
Then she took butane tanks
from her husband\'s house

01:10:16.375 --> 01:10:17.749
and a lighter,

01:10:17.750 --> 01:10:20.290
put them in the backseatof her car,

01:10:20.291 --> 01:10:25.958
and drove by herself to Jerusalem
to blow up the butane tanks

01:10:25.959 --> 01:10:27.958
and kill as manyJewish civilians

01:10:27.959 --> 01:10:30.457
and security personnel as she could.\"

01:10:30.458 --> 01:10:32.040
Is her husband religious?

01:10:32.041 --> 01:10:34.207
[woman] He prays, yes.

01:10:34.208 --> 01:10:36.457
[Lea] How did they meet? He\'s family?

01:10:36.458 --> 01:10:38.290
[woman 2] Yeah, he\'s a relative.

01:10:38.291 --> 01:10:45.333
But the thing is that Israa
didn\'t want to stay with him.

01:10:55.875 --> 01:10:58.125
[Lea] Bye.

01:10:59.625 --> 01:11:01.667
Hello!

01:11:03.708 --> 01:11:09.083
Turn off the heaters before you go, okay?

01:11:09.333 --> 01:11:11.834
I\'m outta here.

01:11:28.125 --> 01:11:31.208
What terrible fatigue.

01:11:33.542 --> 01:11:35.583
[yawns]

01:11:37.750 --> 01:11:41.124
[interviewer]I wasn\'t
sure you\'d takethe case.

01:11:41.125 --> 01:11:43.332
-The woman\'s? -Yes.

01:11:43.333 --> 01:11:45.917
I already said yes.

01:11:46.625 --> 01:11:54.500
No, it\'s not easy, but she needs help.

01:11:54.583 --> 01:11:57.708
Such hard cases.

01:11:58.625 --> 01:12:02.250
[interviewer] Harder than they used to be?

01:12:02.583 --> 01:12:07.290
No, cases like these are always hard,

01:12:07.291 --> 01:12:08.457
but they\'re very hard.

01:12:08.458 --> 01:12:15.374
People who choose to kill
themselves, by way of the police.

01:12:15.375 --> 01:12:16.958
\"Suicide by cop,\" it\'s called.

01:12:16.959 --> 01:12:20.457
Instead of killing themselves on their own,

01:12:20.458 --> 01:12:27.959
they\'ll do something that will bring
a \"respectable\" death upon them.

01:12:28.291 --> 01:12:34.417
It seems there weretwo
suicide attempts in her past

01:12:34.583 --> 01:12:36.707
that didn\'t succeed.

01:12:36.708 --> 01:12:42.874
Was it a suicide bombing, or not?
It\'s not clear-cut.

01:12:42.875 --> 01:12:46.041
But she clearly wanted to die.

01:12:52.542 --> 01:13:00.083
♪ I\'m crazy about her ♪

01:13:00.750 --> 01:13:06.083
♪ I\'m crazy about her ♪

01:13:06.834 --> 01:13:09.583
[chains clinking]

01:13:36.333 --> 01:13:39.332
Do you look the most like Israa?

01:13:39.333 --> 01:13:41.874
-Who does? -No, Mona does.

01:13:41.875 --> 01:13:45.707
- Mona, tell her... -I\'m
not as pretty as Israa.

01:13:45.708 --> 01:13:49.624
In her condition, she clearly
should be under house arrest.

01:13:49.625 --> 01:13:52.582
-Get real, where do you live? -In Israel.

01:13:52.583 --> 01:13:58.666
- Exactly! You should know better.
- No one died, no one died!

01:13:58.667 --> 01:14:00.707
She\'s the one who got hurt, no?

01:14:00.708 --> 01:14:03.666
It\'s different when someone is killed.

01:14:03.667 --> 01:14:07.874
When someone is killed,
you get life in prison.

01:14:07.875 --> 01:14:11.249
That\'s what I\'m saying,
she only hurt herself.

01:14:11.250 --> 01:14:14.582
-You\'re right. -Just herself.

01:14:14.583 --> 01:14:16.416
[woman] She doesn\'t wanther picture taken!

01:14:16.417 --> 01:14:21.874
I\'ll file a complaintagainst any
media outletthat publishes it!

01:14:21.875 --> 01:14:27.666
I have no problemif you interview me.

01:14:27.667 --> 01:14:33.040
But you don\'t have permission
to film her in this condition.

01:14:33.041 --> 01:14:37.207
She doesn\'t want the world
to see her this way.

01:14:37.208 --> 01:14:39.834
Respect it!

01:15:34.000 --> 01:15:36.582
[Lea] Tareq, the cigarette can wait!

01:15:36.583 --> 01:15:38.541
[Tareq] No, it can\'t.

01:15:38.542 --> 01:15:43.707
- They\'re starting the hearing now.
- Give me one minute.

01:15:43.708 --> 01:15:47.165
[Lea] With no will power, they\'ll
break youin interrogation.

01:15:47.166 --> 01:15:51.332
When I went in, the judges
said:\"Work out a plea bargain!

01:15:51.333 --> 01:15:55.541
At least agree on the
punishment, what\'s the problem?

01:15:55.542 --> 01:15:57.707
Agree on the charges, on the sentence.\"

01:15:57.708 --> 01:15:59.958
Then the prosecutor demanded to know:

01:15:59.959 --> 01:16:04.124
\"Might he be acquitted
of attempted murder?\"

01:16:04.125 --> 01:16:05.833
Because they haveto prove intent.

01:16:05.834 --> 01:16:08.124
\"What intent must we prove?\" he said.

01:16:08.125 --> 01:16:11.499
\"With a knife this big,
what intent must we prove?\"

01:16:11.500 --> 01:16:16.666
They still have to prove intent,
given that the boy insists that

01:16:16.667 --> 01:16:22.791
it was only meant to... frighten.

01:16:22.792 --> 01:16:26.457
The knife has to be scary if
you want to scare people.

01:16:26.458 --> 01:16:30.291
If you want to kill, you can do it with...

01:16:31.041 --> 01:16:33.082
A razor! We\'ve got a precedent.

01:16:33.083 --> 01:16:36.624
Jews who killed an Arab,
just because he\'s Arab.

01:16:36.625 --> 01:16:39.749
They found someone whom
they were sure was an Arab.

01:16:39.750 --> 01:16:45.040
They slit his throat with a razor,
from ear to ear, and he died.

01:16:45.041 --> 01:16:50.708
They were chargedwith manslaughter,
not premeditated murder.

01:16:51.375 --> 01:16:53.792
So...

01:16:54.458 --> 01:16:57.541
To scare people, you need a big knife.

01:16:57.542 --> 01:17:00.916
To kill people, there are other ways.

01:17:00.917 --> 01:17:03.500
Plenty of ways.

01:17:04.834 --> 01:17:11.374
The judges said: \"Why don\'t
you reacha plea bargain?\"

01:17:11.375 --> 01:17:12.916
-The judges? -The judges.

01:17:12.917 --> 01:17:15.457
But we don\'t want a bad
plea bargain, right?

01:17:15.458 --> 01:17:19.457
-We don\'t want a bad deal. -No.

01:17:19.458 --> 01:17:24.958
-Lea, I brought you Mentos. -Thank you!

01:17:24.959 --> 01:17:29.166
Thank you, thank you.

01:17:32.125 --> 01:17:34.125
Please, have some.

01:18:41.708 --> 01:18:46.082
[newscaster] In three
days, Ahmad will turn 14.

01:18:46.083 --> 01:18:49.874
But it won\'t be a regular birthday.

01:18:49.875 --> 01:18:53.749
[Ossama] In the media, he\'s a sensation.

01:18:53.750 --> 01:18:55.374
\"The child prisoner.\"

01:18:55.375 --> 01:18:57.541
Be it adult prison or juvenile lockup,

01:18:57.542 --> 01:19:00.749
either way people will
say: \"He\'s doing time.\"

01:19:00.750 --> 01:19:03.833
Like Ahmad said, if he goes to prison,

01:19:03.834 --> 01:19:05.874
he\'ll be recruited by Hamas or Fatah.

01:19:05.875 --> 01:19:10.582
And you can be sure that when he\'s
released, he\'ll commit another act.

01:19:10.583 --> 01:19:12.582
They\'ll convince him by telling him:

01:19:12.583 --> 01:19:19.666
\"When you were little you had
a big name, so now continue.\"

01:19:19.667 --> 01:19:21.707
[Lea] In our meetingswith the prosecution,

01:19:21.708 --> 01:19:24.624
we proposedto scale the punishment.

01:19:24.625 --> 01:19:29.749
A number of yearsin adult prison,
or doublethe time in youth lockup.

01:19:29.750 --> 01:19:33.583
[Ossama]Will the prosecutionagree to it?

01:19:34.166 --> 01:19:34.875
I don\'t know.

01:19:34.876 --> 01:19:40.041
Tareq thinks there\'s no
justiceto be found in court.

01:19:41.458 --> 01:19:44.833
We always face the same conflict,

01:19:44.834 --> 01:19:46.249
I don\'t have unequivocal answers.

01:19:46.250 --> 01:19:52.082
I can\'t tell Tareq he\'s wrong,
because he might not be.

01:19:52.083 --> 01:19:55.833
It\'s quite possible he\'s right.

01:19:55.834 --> 01:20:00.541
He prefers to minimize the
risks, and the risks do exist.

01:20:00.542 --> 01:20:03.749
I told him he can say: \"It\'s Lea\'s fault.\"

01:20:03.750 --> 01:20:08.165
I couldn\'t in good conscience
contribute to the image

01:20:08.166 --> 01:20:14.207
of a Palestinian boy as bloodthirsty.

01:20:14.208 --> 01:20:20.916
The image of a beast.

01:20:20.917 --> 01:20:23.666
That\'s not what he is.

01:20:23.667 --> 01:20:28.333
If he had it in him, maybe. But he doesn\'t.

01:20:28.542 --> 01:20:31.207
Lea, let\'s think about it this way.

01:20:31.208 --> 01:20:35.290
If two Jewish settlerswent
to an Arab village,

01:20:35.291 --> 01:20:37.040
with the same knives,

01:20:37.041 --> 01:20:40.165
one of them stabs, and the other doesn\'t.

01:20:40.166 --> 01:20:45.125
You\'d also attribute
\"attempted murder\" to them.

01:20:45.375 --> 01:20:48.082
[Lea] I would! But the
prosecution wouldn\'t.

01:20:48.083 --> 01:20:48.792
[laughs]

01:20:48.793 --> 01:20:51.875
The prosecution simply wouldn\'t.

01:20:52.208 --> 01:20:55.416
- [Ossama] Okay.-I\'m telling
youthe prosecution wouldn\'t!

01:20:55.417 --> 01:21:00.833
We have a precedentwhere
settlers used guns, not knives!

01:21:00.834 --> 01:21:03.291
They used guns.

01:21:06.750 --> 01:21:11.082
Maybe I\'ve been wrong all
along, what can I say?

01:21:11.083 --> 01:21:12.834
Could be.

01:21:37.750 --> 01:21:42.624
[female newscaster]The special investigations
unitnof the Israeli police shut down

01:21:42.625 --> 01:21:44.874
the Alternative Information Center (AIC),

01:21:44.875 --> 01:21:49.792
and arrested its director,
Michel Warschawski.

01:21:49.875 --> 01:21:52.582
I intend to say one
thingin my interrogation:

01:21:52.583 --> 01:21:57.833
we\'re being accused of ties to
the PFLP, it never happened!

01:21:57.834 --> 01:22:00.083
Quit pretending!

01:22:00.750 --> 01:22:02.749
[male newscaster] The arrest
of Michel Warschawski,

01:22:02.750 --> 01:22:04.958
director of the Alternative
Information Center,

01:22:04.959 --> 01:22:08.124
comes after extensive
intelligence gathering

01:22:08.125 --> 01:22:09.874
that was presentedto the chief of police.

01:22:09.875 --> 01:22:14.374
The police discovered that,
allegedly, among other things,

01:22:14.375 --> 01:22:18.332
the AIC prints and publishes unlawful texts

01:22:18.333 --> 01:22:22.958
authored by the Popular Front for
the Liberation of Palestine.

01:22:22.959 --> 01:22:29.458
This information was disseminated
on behalf of the terrorist group.

01:22:30.667 --> 01:22:33.332
[Lea] When he was arrested, I realized that

01:22:33.333 --> 01:22:39.165
although I\'m used to jails,
prisons and interrogations,

01:22:39.166 --> 01:22:44.000
it\'s not the same when it\'s
your own flesh and blood.

01:22:54.917 --> 01:23:00.040
WHY DID THEY ARREST LEA TSEMEL\'S HUSBAND?

01:23:00.041 --> 01:23:05.374
[Michel] I was interrogated intensively
in what\'s known in Jerusalem

01:23:05.375 --> 01:23:09.416
as \"Cell 20,\" which is the
secret service section.

01:23:09.417 --> 01:23:15.207
On the second day, along came an
interrogator known as \"Judah,\"

01:23:15.208 --> 01:23:18.457
and he started barking and yelling.

01:23:18.458 --> 01:23:23.125
The next day I said to
Lea: \"Get me out of here!\"

01:23:23.708 --> 01:23:24.542
\"What?

01:23:24.543 --> 01:23:28.958
You\'re afraidof that good-for-nothing?

01:23:28.959 --> 01:23:31.749
He interrogatedUdi Adiv in 1973.

01:23:31.750 --> 01:23:34.374
Now it\'s 1987, and he
still has the same job,

01:23:34.375 --> 01:23:38.958
ordering Arabs to get on all
fours and bray like donkeys?

01:23:38.959 --> 01:23:44.457
You\'re afraid of an idiotwho
never got promoted?

01:23:44.458 --> 01:23:47.666
You\'re not worthyof being my husband.\"

01:23:47.667 --> 01:23:51.749
It was a kick in the
face, that helped a lot.

01:23:51.750 --> 01:23:54.749
\"You\'re not worthy of being my husband.\"

01:23:54.750 --> 01:23:58.125
It gave me...

01:24:00.542 --> 01:24:01.375
Strength.

01:24:01.376 --> 01:24:03.249
I thought: \"If I\'m tough on him,

01:24:03.250 --> 01:24:06.792
he\'ll toughen up too.\"

01:24:07.250 --> 01:24:10.040
I don\'t know if he remembers...

01:24:10.041 --> 01:24:11.791
It was...

01:24:11.792 --> 01:24:15.541
Obviously, I had to be tough on him.

01:24:15.542 --> 01:24:21.958
Mm-hmm. To convey my
expectations, which he met.

01:24:21.959 --> 01:24:26.416
At a certain point in my
interrogation, the interrogator said:

01:24:26.417 --> 01:24:31.165
\"You\'ve been active for
years, cursing the state,

01:24:31.166 --> 01:24:35.875
and we never interfered, do you know why?

01:24:36.000 --> 01:24:38.165
Because we live in a democracy.

01:24:38.166 --> 01:24:39.416
But over there,\"

01:24:39.417 --> 01:24:43.040
he pointed toward the East,

01:24:43.041 --> 01:24:46.916
\"there\'s no democracy there,
over there, it\'s occupation.

01:24:46.917 --> 01:24:50.916
And with the AIC, we have a
problem, your position is unclear.

01:24:50.917 --> 01:24:52.958
Are you here or there?\"

01:24:52.959 --> 01:24:54.833
I said: \"We\'re both!\"

01:24:54.834 --> 01:24:58.458
He said: \"Wrong answer.

01:24:58.583 --> 01:25:00.457
It\'s too complicated for us.

01:25:00.458 --> 01:25:01.624
It\'s the gray area.

01:25:01.625 --> 01:25:07.541
If you promise to cut your ties
with the Palestinian side,

01:25:07.542 --> 01:25:10.499
you\'re free, and the AICcan
do whatever it wants.

01:25:10.500 --> 01:25:13.833
But if you maintain tieswith Palestinians,

01:25:13.834 --> 01:25:18.875
we\'ll treat you like Palestinians.\"

01:25:19.125 --> 01:25:26.959
So after another weekend,
all alone in \"Cell 20,\"

01:25:27.041 --> 01:25:32.874
I had enough self-respect, I
wouldn\'t call it courage,

01:25:32.875 --> 01:25:35.207
that when he asked me:
\"Did you think about it?\"

01:25:35.208 --> 01:25:39.750
I said: \"I like the gray area.\"

01:25:43.959 --> 01:25:50.707
Shame. The lead story on the nightly news.

01:25:50.708 --> 01:25:55.207
The father has been arrested, in
front of everybody in Israel,

01:25:55.208 --> 01:25:59.083
and is suspected of...

01:25:59.333 --> 01:26:01.000
treason.

01:26:01.083 --> 01:26:02.041
I repress it.

01:26:02.042 --> 01:26:05.874
I have a little sister,
four, five years old,

01:26:05.875 --> 01:26:09.457
and I have to pretend everything\'s okay.

01:26:09.458 --> 01:26:12.416
I didn\'t attend the trialor
his remand hearing.

01:26:12.417 --> 01:26:16.416
Even the day he was released from prison,

01:26:16.417 --> 01:26:22.333
I pretended to be asleep, because
I couldn\'t face anybody.

01:26:23.166 --> 01:26:26.707
If I saw his character in a documentary,

01:26:26.708 --> 01:26:27.874
I\'d say: \"Wow!

01:26:27.875 --> 01:26:30.999
What courage and conviction!\"

01:26:31.000 --> 01:26:34.290
It\'s not about agreeing with the politics.

01:26:34.291 --> 01:26:36.916
It\'s betting on your lifeand saying:

01:26:36.917 --> 01:26:39.124
\"There\'s something more important.\"

01:26:39.125 --> 01:26:41.999
Children and family are secondary.

01:26:42.000 --> 01:26:47.750
To see a man who believesin
his way, it moves me.

01:26:48.750 --> 01:26:50.333
Yes.

01:26:54.542 --> 01:26:58.374
In the end, he was convicted
of the one charge

01:26:58.375 --> 01:27:02.707
I was willing to admit to in
my initial plea bargain offer.

01:27:02.708 --> 01:27:06.124
That in the AIC, without his knowledge,

01:27:06.125 --> 01:27:11.707
a booklet was being printed on ways to
withstand torture in interrogation.

01:27:11.708 --> 01:27:14.290
How to survive secret service custody.

01:27:14.291 --> 01:27:19.791
Apparently, the booklet was very
threatening to the secret service.

01:27:19.792 --> 01:27:21.624
\"You can\'t reveal our methods!

01:27:21.625 --> 01:27:24.833
Don\'t teach them,\" the
booklet was in Arabic,

01:27:24.834 --> 01:27:29.083
\"what we\'re allowed or forbidden to do.\"

01:27:31.458 --> 01:27:36.374
Since he didn\'t knowwhat
was in the booklet,

01:27:36.375 --> 01:27:39.791
but could have known had he made an effort,

01:27:39.792 --> 01:27:45.332
he was found guilty of willful blindness.

01:27:45.333 --> 01:27:47.082
That was the only conviction.

01:27:47.083 --> 01:27:48.916
[Michel] That was the good news.

01:27:48.917 --> 01:27:54.541
The bad news was that for
each acquittal, 30 out 31,

01:27:54.542 --> 01:27:56.749
they gave me a month in prison.

01:27:56.750 --> 01:27:58.249
Lea isn\'t to blame for the sentence,

01:27:58.250 --> 01:28:01.833
she\'s to be credited for the acquittals.

01:28:01.834 --> 01:28:06.249
I\'d wish it upon anyoneto
have Lea as a lawyer.

01:28:06.250 --> 01:28:10.374
But I don\'t recommend beingboth
her partner and her client.

01:28:10.375 --> 01:28:18.375
Know what it\'s like to share a bed,
with a 800-page legal file between us?

01:28:23.792 --> 01:28:29.541
[male newscaster] The Jerusalem District
Court will deliver the verdict today

01:28:29.542 --> 01:28:31.999
of the 13-year-old terrorist

01:28:32.000 --> 01:28:36.332
who stabbed and injured two
young Jews in Pisgat Zeev.

01:28:36.333 --> 01:28:39.417
[Lea hums]

01:28:45.583 --> 01:28:50.083
The colorful one is prettier.

01:28:53.208 --> 01:28:55.250
Okay.

01:29:02.208 --> 01:29:04.166
Shall we?

01:29:09.083 --> 01:29:12.000
I\'m really into this one.

01:29:12.291 --> 01:29:14.291
Let\'s see.

01:29:16.792 --> 01:29:19.208
I can wear them both!

01:29:19.291 --> 01:29:21.583
[laughs]

01:29:27.542 --> 01:29:30.791
[male newscaster] The court
convicted the 14-year-old boy

01:29:30.792 --> 01:29:33.124
of two attempted murders
and possession of a knife.

01:29:33.125 --> 01:29:35.541
In a month, his punishment
proceedings will be held,

01:29:35.542 --> 01:29:39.666
wherein the prosecutionwill demand
that he goto prison for years.

01:29:39.667 --> 01:29:45.457
[Lea] There was no attempted
murder, nor intent to murder!

01:29:45.458 --> 01:29:47.874
[prosecutor] We received the verdict today.

01:29:47.875 --> 01:29:54.082
I heard the miserable
statementsof advocate Lea Tsemel.

01:29:54.083 --> 01:29:56.874
A shameful attempt to confuse...

01:29:56.875 --> 01:29:58.207
[Lea]You\'re talking about me?

01:29:58.208 --> 01:30:00.958
Between the victimand
the loathsome murderer.

01:30:00.959 --> 01:30:06.874
- [Lea] The loathsome murderer? -[prosecutor]
Who tried to take a child\'s life.

01:30:06.875 --> 01:30:07.750
Don\'t be confused.

01:30:07.751 --> 01:30:11.999
This is a kid with a kid\'s face.
But he\'s a terrorist!

01:30:12.000 --> 01:30:14.958
A terrorist who must never
see the light of day.

01:30:14.959 --> 01:30:18.082
-Did you hear the news? -[man] Yeah.

01:30:18.083 --> 01:30:19.541
So, what do you say?

01:30:19.542 --> 01:30:25.374
- What do you think, is it okay?
- Of course, it\'s not okay!

01:30:25.375 --> 01:30:26.624
-Of course, not.-Huh?

01:30:26.625 --> 01:30:31.250
-It\'s politically influenced. -[Lea] Yes.

01:30:34.458 --> 01:30:37.708
Let\'s see what Ahmad says.

01:30:39.417 --> 01:30:41.583
Hello.

01:30:46.083 --> 01:30:49.625
So, Ahmad. What do you say?

01:30:49.708 --> 01:30:52.791
Lea, it\'s a big shock.

01:30:52.792 --> 01:30:53.708
No?

01:30:53.709 --> 01:30:55.958
It\'s too bad you went to trial!

01:30:55.959 --> 01:30:58.124
-[Lea] Why too bad? -It really is.

01:30:58.125 --> 01:31:03.040
- You should have made a deal.
- There was no deal to make.

01:31:03.041 --> 01:31:07.707
Within a month he\'d have
gotten the same judgment, no?

01:31:07.708 --> 01:31:10.707
I don\'t know, what do you think?

01:31:10.708 --> 01:31:12.499
I chose to go to trial!

01:31:12.500 --> 01:31:15.750
I\'m the one who decidedto go to trial.

01:31:23.166 --> 01:31:28.834
Looks like an annoying
verdict, from what I see.

01:31:30.041 --> 01:31:32.417
Very superficial.

01:31:35.291 --> 01:31:40.958
From the outset, it seems, I
still haven\'t read it all.

01:31:40.959 --> 01:31:46.666
\"The only thing the courtmust
determine regardingthe stabbing

01:31:46.667 --> 01:31:48.999
is whether he intended to kill.

01:31:49.000 --> 01:31:52.875
Did he decide to cause death?\"

01:31:53.583 --> 01:31:55.834
And...

01:31:57.500 --> 01:31:58.916
The court finds he did.

01:31:58.917 --> 01:32:03.082
\"The defendant revealed his
intentions to the interrogators,

01:32:03.083 --> 01:32:04.499
attesting to his heart\'s desire.

01:32:04.500 --> 01:32:06.749
\'It would be a pity if we kill children.\'\"

01:32:06.750 --> 01:32:12.040
From which the judge concludes:
\"Their sole intent was to kill.\"

01:32:12.041 --> 01:32:17.249
[scoffs]He claims that this
demonstratesthe kid\'s intent to kill.

01:32:17.250 --> 01:32:20.542
How? I don\'t understand.

01:32:22.417 --> 01:32:25.624
\"Their sole intent was to kill.\"

01:32:25.625 --> 01:32:27.708
Fantastic.

01:32:30.542 --> 01:32:32.082
And...

01:32:32.083 --> 01:32:33.374
\"The defendant\'s claim that

01:32:33.375 --> 01:32:37.249
stabbing the boy deviated from their
plan not to hurt children or elderly

01:32:37.250 --> 01:32:44.166
is rejected by us as we determine
that there never was such a plan.\"

01:32:44.542 --> 01:32:46.083
Wow.

01:32:50.542 --> 01:32:53.125
Wow, wow, wow.

01:32:56.834 --> 01:33:00.875
Wow, not a sliver of hope.

01:33:06.125 --> 01:33:12.207
It\'s as if I live with the illusion...

01:33:12.208 --> 01:33:16.457
that I can do something in
the world, make an impact,

01:33:16.458 --> 01:33:19.500
that there\'s someone to reason with.

01:33:19.667 --> 01:33:21.916
It\'s strange...

01:33:21.917 --> 01:33:26.417
I\'m not willing to give up trying.

01:33:30.250 --> 01:33:35.208
And our kid didn\'t even use his knife.

01:33:53.250 --> 01:33:56.291
It\'s really strange to me...

01:33:57.625 --> 01:34:00.750
I wonder...

01:34:01.000 --> 01:34:06.834
Don\'t the judges see he\'s a kid?
And a nice one?

01:34:09.166 --> 01:34:14.874
A bit lost, what did he decide,
what did he think, he testified.

01:34:14.875 --> 01:34:17.582
There are all those quotes
from his testimony.

01:34:17.583 --> 01:34:21.916
As if there\'s some kind
of impenetrable screen,

01:34:21.917 --> 01:34:26.666
like the separation barrier,
that can\'t be overcome.

01:34:26.667 --> 01:34:29.708
When it comes to \"security.\"

01:34:31.583 --> 01:34:33.250
Strange.

01:34:52.291 --> 01:34:53.250
We always lose.

01:34:53.251 --> 01:34:59.624
[in English] For us, a victory is if we
get a deduction of a year out of five.

01:34:59.625 --> 01:35:01.707
We did our day, you know?

01:35:01.708 --> 01:35:04.165
If we manage to visit a client

01:35:04.166 --> 01:35:06.457
while he\'s stillin interrogation.

01:35:06.458 --> 01:35:10.207
If we just manage to see him and say:

01:35:10.208 --> 01:35:11.166
\"Hi, I\'m your lawyer.\"

01:35:11.167 --> 01:35:14.124
Many of my friends laugh at me by now.

01:35:14.125 --> 01:35:19.374
I start a new case with all
the possible optimism.

01:35:19.375 --> 01:35:23.374
And I\'m sure now in this
case, I\'m going to win.

01:35:23.375 --> 01:35:24.457
I\'m going to make it.

01:35:24.458 --> 01:35:27.249
This person will not be deported.

01:35:27.250 --> 01:35:32.332
And again and again and
again, time after time.

01:35:32.333 --> 01:35:35.791
-You never win those cases? -No.

01:35:35.792 --> 01:35:39.582
Until now, I\'m sorry to say, never.

01:35:39.583 --> 01:35:41.416
[in Hebrew]She doesn\'t manageto
defeat the occupation.

01:35:41.417 --> 01:35:48.833
Even though she\'s sure it\'ll happen
in her lifetime, and thanks to her.

01:35:48.834 --> 01:35:52.457
On the one hand, I\'d
like to have her powers.

01:35:52.458 --> 01:35:57.999
To take her Wonder Woman suit
and put it on and have no fear.

01:35:58.000 --> 01:36:03.207
Not really have no fear, but
have no qualms or hang ups.

01:36:03.208 --> 01:36:05.624
To go forth without hesitation.

01:36:05.625 --> 01:36:09.332
On the other hand, that\'s
exactly what I wouldn\'t want.

01:36:09.333 --> 01:36:11.207
It\'s the outfitl\'d never choose.

01:36:11.208 --> 01:36:16.416
And yet, it\'s so rareto
meet women like that,

01:36:16.417 --> 01:36:21.332
who do their thing so unapologetically.

01:36:21.333 --> 01:36:24.834
I wouldn\'t trade her in.

01:36:25.917 --> 01:36:30.332
I\'m willing to pay the price

01:36:30.333 --> 01:36:35.165
for there to be room for a
woman like that to exist,

01:36:35.166 --> 01:36:37.291
as she is.

01:36:37.834 --> 01:36:41.124
[Lea] If Israel abided by
the Geneva Conventions,

01:36:41.125 --> 01:36:43.416
the Convention Against Torture,

01:36:43.417 --> 01:36:47.207
the Conventionfor the
Protection of Children,

01:36:47.208 --> 01:36:49.040
we wouldn\'t needthe Supreme Court!

01:36:49.041 --> 01:36:50.916
Lea Tsemel, explain your position.

01:36:50.917 --> 01:36:54.207
We\'re forced to petitionthe
Supreme Court often,

01:36:54.208 --> 01:36:56.916
- and come out empty-handed. -[man]
Maybe because you\'re wrong!

01:36:56.917 --> 01:37:03.332
Because \"security\" is the dragon
that guards the judiciary\'s gates!

01:37:03.333 --> 01:37:05.582
In other countries, you
couldn\'t even petition!

01:37:05.583 --> 01:37:08.541
But no other country has
a 25-year occupation!

01:37:08.542 --> 01:37:11.874
Ms. Lea Tsemel, stick to the topic!

01:37:11.875 --> 01:37:14.833
My clients have no recourse
other than the Supreme Court,

01:37:14.834 --> 01:37:18.208
and it slams the door in their face!

01:37:20.750 --> 01:37:27.165
[female newscaster] After a decade of legal
battles, they pose for a victory photo.

01:37:27.166 --> 01:37:32.207
We made history today!
What a moving decision.

01:37:32.208 --> 01:37:35.040
A just ruling, a warranted ruling.

01:37:35.041 --> 01:37:38.833
Too bad we didn\'t conduct
this struggle 30 years ago.

01:37:38.834 --> 01:37:44.082
[newscaster] Nine years, nine justices,
and one Supreme Court bottom line:

01:37:44.083 --> 01:37:49.290
\"All interrogation methods that entail
physical pressure are illegal.\"

01:37:49.291 --> 01:37:54.874
[Lea] As soon as the Supreme
Court handed down its decision,

01:37:54.875 --> 01:37:58.749
I knew that for once, we\'d won!

01:37:58.750 --> 01:38:02.791
The security service had been exposed.

01:38:02.792 --> 01:38:07.457
It was a wonderful feeling.

01:38:07.458 --> 01:38:10.707
I wanted to burst into song.

01:38:10.708 --> 01:38:13.374
Shame on you!

01:38:13.375 --> 01:38:15.416
You\'re the enemy of the secret service!

01:38:15.417 --> 01:38:18.582
Today\'s ruling is a
climaxin my legal career.

01:38:18.583 --> 01:38:23.040
The Supreme Court canceledthe
secret service\'s \"special methods.\"

01:38:23.041 --> 01:38:26.124
-What did we achieve? -[interviewer] Yes.

01:38:26.125 --> 01:38:30.040
Torture became more
problematic and less obvious.

01:38:30.041 --> 01:38:33.249
They can\'t do it anytime and anywhere.

01:38:33.250 --> 01:38:36.624
It became a bit more sensitive.

01:38:36.625 --> 01:38:39.916
But over time, that too is eroding.

01:38:39.917 --> 01:38:42.999
[interviewer] What happened in practice?

01:38:43.000 --> 01:38:46.542
The secret service doesn\'t abide by it.

01:38:47.375 --> 01:38:49.708
[interviewer] What\'s justice?

01:38:50.500 --> 01:38:52.416
[chuckles]

01:38:52.417 --> 01:38:53.375
I don\'t know.

01:38:53.376 --> 01:38:58.708
Since I don\'t believe in
justice, I have no answer.

01:39:05.291 --> 01:39:08.250
[interviewer] What\'s a fair trial?

01:39:10.375 --> 01:39:15.791
A fair trial means giving
both sides an equal chance.

01:39:15.792 --> 01:39:22.124
But since the balance of
power is a priori unequal,

01:39:22.125 --> 01:39:25.750
a fair chance is never given.

01:39:27.375 --> 01:39:30.416
Lea believes in it, I don\'t.

01:39:30.417 --> 01:39:36.250
It\'s to Lea\'s advantagethat
she believes in it.

01:39:46.041 --> 01:39:47.999
[murmuring]

01:39:48.000 --> 01:39:52.083
-It\'s just me, guys. -[laughter]

01:39:54.667 --> 01:39:56.625
Wait there!

01:40:00.166 --> 01:40:04.000
[camera shutters clicking]

01:40:04.625 --> 01:40:06.542
Come.

01:40:09.291 --> 01:40:11.125
Come on.

01:40:13.333 --> 01:40:19.583
[reporter]We hear the prosecution
askedfor 12 years in an adult prison.

01:40:21.083 --> 01:40:24.040
They said somethingto that effect.

01:40:24.041 --> 01:40:27.541
He expressed remorse...

01:40:27.542 --> 01:40:31.082
Especially to the other
kid, who was stabbed.

01:40:31.083 --> 01:40:33.249
[reporter] What did he say to him?

01:40:33.250 --> 01:40:37.166
He said he\'s sorrythat the kid got hurt.

01:40:38.875 --> 01:40:41.958
We expect the court to take that

01:40:41.959 --> 01:40:47.332
into full considerationin their judgment.

01:40:47.333 --> 01:40:51.083
That\'s it. It ain\'t over\'til it\'s over.

01:40:53.291 --> 01:40:55.875
Where\'s Tareq now?

01:40:59.667 --> 01:41:00.958
Still the same documentary?

01:41:00.959 --> 01:41:04.624
Have you seenattorney Tareq Barghout?

01:41:04.625 --> 01:41:08.999
Allahu akbar. Don\'t drag it, pick it up!

01:41:09.000 --> 01:41:11.749
-No, no!-[Tareq] How, from there?

01:41:11.750 --> 01:41:15.166
-[Lea] Like this.-[Tareq] Hold on.

01:41:17.041 --> 01:41:19.541
You\'re becoming an old lady,
can\'t do it yourself.

01:41:19.542 --> 01:41:22.332
Sure I can! You wanna arm wrestle me?

01:41:22.333 --> 01:41:24.499
[both laugh]

01:41:24.500 --> 01:41:28.249
- Can you help me find an
intern?-[Tareq] You need an intern?

01:41:28.250 --> 01:41:32.207
My intern left me, I told you! Listen!

01:41:32.208 --> 01:41:32.917
Yeah?

01:41:32.918 --> 01:41:35.999
The guy worked with mefor
two and a half weeks.

01:41:36.000 --> 01:41:39.999
I asked him to filea court
request electronically.

01:41:40.000 --> 01:41:41.791
He says: \"I don\'t know how.\"

01:41:41.792 --> 01:41:44.290
I said: \"How come? They taught you!\"

01:41:44.291 --> 01:41:50.457
I said: \"I gotta go. Ask Ahmad or Suheila.

01:41:50.458 --> 01:41:54.040
Otherwise, eat shit. You have to file it.\"

01:41:54.041 --> 01:41:56.249
Oy, oy, oy, oy, oy...

01:41:56.250 --> 01:41:59.249
The next morning, I find a note on my desk.

01:41:59.250 --> 01:42:03.916
\"Dear attorney Tsemel, I worked
with you between these dates,

01:42:03.917 --> 01:42:05.874
you told me to eat shit.

01:42:05.875 --> 01:42:09.707
I\'m leaving. Thanks, goodbye.\"

01:42:09.708 --> 01:42:14.916
So I need an intern who can \"eat shit.\"

01:42:14.917 --> 01:42:16.916
I\'ll look for someone like that!

01:42:16.917 --> 01:42:21.457
He didn\'t realize it\'s the usual slang?

01:42:21.458 --> 01:42:25.833
You always call me \"motherfucker.\"

01:42:25.834 --> 01:42:29.208
-Right!-[laughs]

01:42:38.708 --> 01:42:42.917
[Lea hums]

01:42:43.083 --> 01:42:45.541
Can you open the gate please?

01:42:45.542 --> 01:42:47.541
Guard!

01:42:47.542 --> 01:42:50.417
Warden, open the gate.

01:42:51.333 --> 01:42:54.499
-[man] They didn\'t let Mona in. -Why?

01:42:54.500 --> 01:43:01.999
- They said the judge will only let
her parents enter. -[Lea] No way!

01:43:02.000 --> 01:43:05.958
- Tell them to let her in.-[Lea]
I\'ll talkto the judge too!

01:43:05.959 --> 01:43:11.417
- I\'ll talk to the guards first.
- Tell them to let her in.

01:43:12.208 --> 01:43:13.958
Mona!

01:43:13.959 --> 01:43:15.834
Come!

01:43:24.250 --> 01:43:28.083
[camera shutters clicking]

01:43:36.875 --> 01:43:38.958
-[woman] That\'s it? -[Lea] What?

01:43:38.959 --> 01:43:42.457
- Was she sentenced? How much?
- Eleven years.

01:43:42.458 --> 01:43:43.958
-[Mona] Israa! -No!

01:43:43.959 --> 01:43:47.708
-My love.-My life.

01:43:49.667 --> 01:43:51.457
[Mona] What do you mean 11 years?

01:43:51.458 --> 01:43:56.458
- [Israa\'s mother] Why 11 years?
- [Mona] God almighty!

01:43:58.333 --> 01:44:01.666
-Eleven? -[Israa\'s mother] What for?

01:44:01.667 --> 01:44:05.082
What did she do?

01:44:05.083 --> 01:44:07.416
What do they want from her?

01:44:07.417 --> 01:44:12.333
What did she do to you people?

01:44:20.291 --> 01:44:26.834
[Israa\'s father] This is a state
of sinners! A mafia state!

01:44:31.583 --> 01:44:34.082
God is greater than you!

01:44:34.083 --> 01:44:38.624
- God is great!-[Israa\'s
father]God is greater than you!

01:44:38.625 --> 01:44:40.457
[Mona]God is greater than you!

01:44:40.458 --> 01:44:43.666
God is great and you know it!

01:44:43.667 --> 01:44:47.457
You found her guilty for
saying: \"God is great!\"

01:44:47.458 --> 01:44:51.874
All the while knowingand
believing that God is great!

01:44:51.875 --> 01:44:54.541
[camera shutters clicking]

01:44:54.542 --> 01:44:57.834
[reporter] Ahmad, how you doing?

01:45:07.041 --> 01:45:09.083
[Mona] Criminals!

01:45:10.083 --> 01:45:15.458
You say we\'re terrorists,
but you\'re the terrorists!

01:45:20.000 --> 01:45:24.667
[Israa\'s mother sobs]

01:45:32.458 --> 01:45:36.207
His sentencing is at 1:00?

01:45:36.208 --> 01:45:39.625
[camera shutters clicking]

01:45:47.125 --> 01:45:48.958
[reporter]What do you
thinkof your sentence?

01:45:48.959 --> 01:45:53.917
- [woman] Lea, what did they give
him?-Twelve years in prison.

01:46:13.125 --> 01:46:16.792
Go on, prepare the press.

01:46:18.083 --> 01:46:22.165
- [Tareq] Lea, what do you want to do now?
- [Lea] What?

01:46:22.166 --> 01:46:23.332
Are you staying or going?

01:46:23.333 --> 01:46:26.040
There are reporters, we have to face them.

01:46:26.041 --> 01:46:27.874
You\'ll be next to me.

01:46:27.875 --> 01:46:31.416
- You can\'t get out of
it.-I\'m not trying to!

01:46:31.417 --> 01:46:36.624
Come stand with me, it\'s
hard for all of us.

01:46:36.625 --> 01:46:41.417
-I\'m going to talk to... Lea! -What?

01:46:42.875 --> 01:46:44.542
Tareq!

01:46:44.750 --> 01:46:46.875
Yes!

01:46:48.250 --> 01:46:51.708
-What now? -I can\'t.

01:46:54.333 --> 01:46:56.959
[Lea] Okay, never mind.

01:47:01.708 --> 01:47:06.374
I\'m sure you\'d like to hear the
response of the defense...

01:47:06.375 --> 01:47:07.416
[Tareq] Motherfucker!

01:47:07.417 --> 01:47:11.124
[Lea] To the two sentences issued today

01:47:11.125 --> 01:47:14.667
in the Jerusalem District Court.

01:47:15.291 --> 01:47:17.332
Our response is:

01:47:17.333 --> 01:47:18.333
We\'ve been defeated!

01:47:18.334 --> 01:47:23.833
Both in the case of Israa Jaabisand
in the case of the minor.

01:47:23.834 --> 01:47:31.082
But our defeat, as a legal
team, is nothing compared to

01:47:31.083 --> 01:47:33.916
the far-reaching and long-lasting defeat

01:47:33.917 --> 01:47:38.666
for Israeli societyand its judicial system.

01:47:38.667 --> 01:47:45.249
The court ignored the fact
thatthis is a national conflict.

01:47:45.250 --> 01:47:50.624
It attributed anti-Semiticsentiments
to both defendants,

01:47:50.625 --> 01:47:54.416
which neither of
themexpressed at any stage.

01:47:54.417 --> 01:47:59.332
But it\'s convenient to think:
\"They only want to hurtthe Jews!\"

01:47:59.333 --> 01:48:02.332
Fifty years of occupationwere
stricken from the record,

01:48:02.333 --> 01:48:07.249
and vanished from the
judges\'consciousness, unfortunately.

01:48:07.250 --> 01:48:10.124
I hope it won\'t vanishfrom
the public\'s consciousness.

01:48:10.125 --> 01:48:14.749
- There is an occupation!-[reporter]
Does nationalconflict permit murder?

01:48:14.750 --> 01:48:16.290
And it must be responded to.

01:48:16.291 --> 01:48:20.332
And everyone does soaccording
to their capabilities.

01:48:20.333 --> 01:48:23.124
The victims, the vanquished,

01:48:23.125 --> 01:48:27.040
the children, the women,

01:48:27.041 --> 01:48:29.290
respond in their own way.

01:48:29.291 --> 01:48:33.082
The expectation...

01:48:33.083 --> 01:48:37.124
that Palestinians can find
justice in Israeli courts,

01:48:37.125 --> 01:48:42.082
may have been buried for good, I hope not.

01:48:42.083 --> 01:48:42.959
I really hope not.

01:48:42.960 --> 01:48:46.707
The path to the Supreme Court
still lies ahead of us.

01:48:46.708 --> 01:48:49.958
We will appealas soon as possible,

01:48:49.959 --> 01:48:53.249
in pursuit of justice. Thank you!

01:48:53.250 --> 01:48:55.249
Your name and title?

01:48:55.250 --> 01:48:57.249
Lea Tsemel,

01:48:57.250 --> 01:48:59.290
losing lawyer.

01:48:59.291 --> 01:49:00.208
That\'s the title.

01:49:00.209 --> 01:49:04.916
Lea, why appeal if you no
longer believe in the courts?

01:49:04.917 --> 01:49:07.792
I want to change them.

01:49:07.875 --> 01:49:10.249
I\'ll force them to change!

01:49:10.250 --> 01:49:12.124
Drive, I\'ll direct you.

01:49:12.125 --> 01:49:13.749
-Via Begin Road?-No!

01:49:13.750 --> 01:49:17.290
- Take a left here. -[driver]
I know how to go.

01:49:17.291 --> 01:49:21.165
No, don\'t go on Begin.

01:49:21.166 --> 01:49:21.917
Shut up!

01:49:21.918 --> 01:49:24.874
I\'ll guide you, I\'m telling you the truth.

01:49:24.875 --> 01:49:28.666
Left! Enter through...

01:49:28.667 --> 01:49:30.582
Go straight, then right.

01:49:30.583 --> 01:49:31.458
We\'ll hit traffic!

01:49:31.459 --> 01:49:34.124
The biggest traffic jam is on Begin Road!

01:49:34.125 --> 01:49:37.124
-Not at this hour. -Huh? Ha!

01:49:37.125 --> 01:49:39.791
Put Supreme Court on the GPS, you\'ll see!

01:49:39.792 --> 01:49:43.749
- [phone rings] -Just don\'t
listen to his directions.

01:49:43.750 --> 01:49:45.666
[in English] Hello.

01:49:45.667 --> 01:49:49.374
[in Hebrew] Of course, we\'ll be appealing

01:49:49.375 --> 01:49:54.542
both the verdictand the sentence.

01:49:58.625 --> 01:50:01.457
We\'ll see, maybe. We can only hope.

01:50:01.458 --> 01:50:07.625
Hope is what keeps us going, otherwise
we\'d have given up long ago.

01:50:07.708 --> 01:50:10.625
[Tareq\'s ringtone plays]

01:50:11.375 --> 01:50:15.958
I\'m a very angry optimistic woman.

01:50:15.959 --> 01:50:17.874
[Tareq sighs]

01:50:17.875 --> 01:50:21.417
Lea, Lea, Lea.

01:51:15.083 --> 01:51:17.208
[door slams]

01:51:45.458 --> 01:51:49.041
[Lea hums]

01:51:56.917 --> 01:52:00.750
[continues humming]

01:52:01.083 --> 01:52:03.500
[Lea] Hey, Yasser.

01:52:25.834 --> 01:52:27.750
Tareq!

01:52:35.125 --> 01:52:37.208
Yasser!

01:52:41.125 --> 01:52:46.542
Oy, oy, oy, oy. Aye, aye, aye...

01:53:22.917 --> 01:53:27.041
[laughing]